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TIGSource ForumsDeveloperTechnical (Moderator: ThemsAllTook)Devs working on retina screens
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Armageddon
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« on: August 15, 2017, 07:40:29 PM »

Hey y'all so uh I got a question and that question is how is it to work with pixel art and play pixel art type games lowres games on Apple Retina (TM) displays? They look trash to me how do I know my art making will stil lb good?

Thank u
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Superb Joe
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« Reply #1 on: August 16, 2017, 01:12:46 PM »

i have a 4k 13 inch lap top and you might not know this but computers can make images larger so every thing is the regular size
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Armageddon
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« Reply #2 on: August 16, 2017, 09:40:55 PM »

Yeah but retina makes all shit blurry af to me.
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Superb Joe
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« Reply #3 on: August 17, 2017, 01:05:22 AM »

Yeah but retina makes all shit blurry af to me.
then the setup is wrong. i have the pc style of computer and it looks normal
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rj
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« Reply #4 on: August 17, 2017, 01:34:22 AM »

fucker i use retina all the damn ass time just fucking 2x your fucking art in photoshop with nearest neighbor. done
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Bad_Dude 2017
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« Reply #5 on: August 17, 2017, 01:56:24 AM »

shit man, shit
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ProgramGamer
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« Reply #6 on: August 17, 2017, 02:12:58 AM »

Most engines and graphic libraries have a way to upscale renders with a nearest neighbour algorithm, which means you'll keep the crispness of your pixel art. Please post what engine or library you're using so we can assist you further.

Also, this is in the wrong board, I'm moving it to technical.
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Armageddon
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« Reply #7 on: August 17, 2017, 02:30:21 AM »

I'm talking about rendering pixel art at it's native 1:1 resolution, it's not crisp cause you physically can't see the pixels it's basically blurred. Yes upscaling will make it crisper but I'm not interested in developing a game with 2x or 3x or so on resolutions.
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muki
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« Reply #8 on: August 17, 2017, 03:12:58 AM »

Do you mean it gets blurred when you zoom in (not scale) art from your graphics program?

if so I don't think this has anything to do with your type of display.

which art program?
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rj
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« Reply #9 on: August 17, 2017, 03:16:21 AM »

I'm talking about rendering pixel art at it's native 1:1 resolution, it's not crisp cause you physically can't see the pixels it's basically blurred. Yes upscaling will make it crisper but I'm not interested in developing a game with 2x or 3x or so on resolutions.

well that's the solution buddy
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powly
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« Reply #10 on: August 17, 2017, 03:31:57 AM »

Do you mean it gets blurred when you zoom in (not scale) art from your graphics program?

if so I don't think this has anything to do with your type of display.

which art program?
No, he explicitly stated that this happens without any scaling, it's just a pixel density problem. No workarounds available, scale it or get a lower res screen.
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oahda
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« Reply #11 on: August 17, 2017, 03:39:09 AM »

pixel art at 1:1 on a modern screen/resolution (unless you're planning on changing the resolution) is way too small anyway unless you're planning to draw really hi-res pixel art (and if you're OK with turning the resolution down you might as well upscale, no difference)

what's your intent?
« Last Edit: August 17, 2017, 03:51:22 AM by Prinsessa » Logged

muki
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« Reply #12 on: August 17, 2017, 05:29:45 AM »

Do you mean it gets blurred when you zoom in (not scale) art from your graphics program?

if so I don't think this has anything to do with your type of display.

which art program?
No, he explicitly stated that this happens without any scaling, it's just a pixel density problem. No workarounds available, scale it or get a lower res screen.

I read that, I meant zooming in, not scaling. The difference between scaling an image, and ctrl+/mousewheel to "look closer".

I wrote that because some image programs definitely interpolate images when zooming in. Sometimes it can be disabled in the program's display options.

I do low res pixel art on a reasonably HD display (1440p) and have no problem with blur, which is why I suspect they're using art software that blurs pixels when zooming in (again not scaling).
« Last Edit: August 17, 2017, 05:38:06 AM by muki » Logged
powly
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« Reply #13 on: August 17, 2017, 06:14:56 AM »

I read that, I meant zooming in, not scaling.
For 2D graphics these are the exact same operation???
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muki
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« Reply #14 on: August 17, 2017, 06:21:29 AM »

I read that, I meant zooming in, not scaling.
For 2D graphics these are the exact same operation???

zoom in/out and image rescale are not at all the same operation in graphics programs. zoom in allows you to look at your image closer, but doesn't change the data. rescale enlarges the image by changing the data.

in most software, rescaling (changing the data) gives you interpolation options, nearest neighbor, bicubic, bilinear, etc. but if you're simply zooming in on the image (not changing the data), some programs interpolate/blur what you see as you zoom in and it's sometimes necessary to turn it off in the options if you're working on pixel art.
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oahda
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« Reply #15 on: August 17, 2017, 07:00:11 AM »

That's not it, muki. It's the pixel density that powly mentioned. I have a retina screen right here and the pixel art icons here on TIGS for example look a bit anti-aliased because of it.
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muki
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« Reply #16 on: August 17, 2017, 07:23:56 AM »

That's not it, muki. It's the pixel density that powly mentioned. I have a retina screen right here and the pixel art icons here on TIGS for example look a bit anti-aliased because of it.

I don't know anything about macs. But on PCs, if you set the resolution to anything lower than the display native, pixels will be blurry as well. The display hardware/drivers will interpolate it back up to native res in theory.
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oahda
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« Reply #17 on: August 17, 2017, 07:59:34 AM »

Yeah, that's true, I'm cramming in the highest resolution I can.
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ThemsAllTook
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« Reply #18 on: August 17, 2017, 08:29:01 AM »

I'm talking about rendering pixel art at it's native 1:1 resolution, it's not crisp cause you physically can't see the pixels it's basically blurred.

That doesn't sound right. Native-sized pixels on my retina display are perfectly crisp, just tiny. In some cases though (for example, a webpage that doesn't provide @2x sizes), images will be upscaled by default with something other than nearest neighbor interpolation. Maybe this is what you're seeing? Retina-unaware applications usually use nearest neighbor for the entire thing, which looks noticeably more jagged than the same thing rendered on a non-retina display. If your window's title bar isn't pixely but your pixels aren't tiny, you're probably getting interpolated scaling.
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oahda
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« Reply #19 on: August 17, 2017, 08:36:07 AM »

That's what I meant, but I realise now "pixel density" isn't the right term, sorry for the confusion. x: You're right about the interpolation. I mostly see this in a browser.
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