next »

[beetleking22]

Im creating my own top down action adventure game. I have been trying to study a lot of dungeon design from various Zelda and Zelda like games. I have been noticing that there is sometimes rooms which just have simple switches that activates some simple platforms or open wall doors.  Is this design supposed to make the dungeon feel like you are doing something? You could just place some platform there already and remove switches and it would be the just same thing only without activating them.

Here is one example from Link between world.

https://imgur.com/a/T94ZYmX

[litHermit]

It's often just busy work. But if not abused can add to the immersion and a sense of activity, instead of being grating. I feel Zelda games often balance that pretty well.

[beetleking22]

It's often just busy work. But if not abused can add to the immersion and a sense of activity, instead of being grating. I feel Zelda games often balance that pretty well.

Do you have example of overused in some games? In Link between world they use them often but yes they are well balanced in zelda games  as you said.

[litHermit]

Quick time events in adventure games are the definition of overuse of busy-work.

[ProgramGamer]

Does that dungeon use buttons in more complicated ways later on? It might be teaching the player about the mechanic, or reminding them that it exists and that they should be thinking about it later on.

[Lo-Phi]

Does that dungeon use buttons in more complicated ways later on? It might be teaching the player about the mechanic, or reminding them that it exists and that they should be thinking about it later on.

This is the correct answer. Nintendo usually introduces puzzle complexity one step at a time in the Zelda franchise. It's basically a check to make sure the player understands what the switch does and why it needs to be pressed. It helps prevent the player from getting stuck on a complex puzzle later on due to not understanding the fundamental pieces of the puzzle.

[litHermit]

There's definitely "teaching mechanics" switches in Zelda games, and most (especially in later dungeons) seem pointless but are parts of a larger puzzle. However I don't feel it's true they use them solely for that reason.

I might be totally wrong, but if memory serves me correctly from OOT and LA, occasionally they just place a switch (or rather an overly simple "puzzle" that's long since been learned) here and there with rather weak "design reasons" aside making a room feel less void of action. But hmmm, maybe those are the reminders ProgramGamer is mentioning. 

[Unknown33]

I did level design for a game where you slide penguins and ice blocks around ice.

The creator was having trouble making new level ideas, so he paid me $100.00 just to do this one task.

I figured out new ways of combining his basic mechanics to add variety and texture to the levels, and even discovered new functionality he never knew he built.

A good level designer is always looking for interesting ways to make new things from the basic lego set the relatively unimaginative designer hands them. Sometimes that's a simple room where a switch makes a ladder fall. Sometimes it's ten switches and ten ladders and where is your god now... mwahahah

As level editors we have no way to speak to the player. So we say... switch... thing happens. Switch... thing... switch, but no thing you see this time... but you know switches do things... figure it out...!

[beetleking22]

I did level design for a game where you slide penguins and ice blocks around ice.

The creator was having trouble making new level ideas, so he paid me $100.00 just to do this one task.

I figured out new ways of combining his basic mechanics to add variety and texture to the levels, and even discovered new functionality he never knew he built.

A good level designer is always looking for interesting ways to make new things from the basic lego set the relatively unimaginative designer hands them. Sometimes that's a simple room where a switch makes a ladder fall. Sometimes it's ten switches and ten ladders and where is your god now... mwahahah

As level editors we have no way to speak to the player. So we say... switch... thing happens. Switch... thing... switch, but no thing you see this time... but you know switches do things... figure it out...!

Yes I have seen this from Alundra, Mario and many other games.  They introduce mechanics and they use it different way in rooms which adds a lot of variety but it can also feel repetitive if there is not enough new mechanics introduce like in Alundra.

[beetleking22]

Does that dungeon use buttons in more complicated ways later on? It might be teaching the player about the mechanic, or reminding them that it exists and that they should be thinking about it later on.

Yes they use it complicated way for example luring Wall master to push the buttons but this moments happen after it. So its really not tutorial.

[Unknown33]

I did level design for a game where you slide penguins and ice blocks around ice.

The creator was having trouble making new level ideas, so he paid me $100.00 just to do this one task.

I figured out new ways of combining his basic mechanics to add variety and texture to the levels, and even discovered new functionality he never knew he built.

A good level designer is always looking for interesting ways to make new things from the basic lego set the relatively unimaginative designer hands them. Sometimes that's a simple room where a switch makes a ladder fall. Sometimes it's ten switches and ten ladders and where is your god now... mwahahah

As level editors we have no way to speak to the player. So we say... switch... thing happens. Switch... thing... switch, but no thing you see this time... but you know switches do things... figure it out...!

Yes I have seen this from Alundra, Mario and many other games.  They introduce mechanics and they use it different way in rooms which adds a lot of variety but it can also feel repetitive if there is not enough new mechanics introduce like in Alundra.

Yeah, once you've exhausted what you can do with your toys you need to add a new toy. Keep that up, balanced with some repetitious but pleasant activity that fills the space between your interesting combinations of toys and punctuate it with occasional tests of mastery for your various mechanics in increasing difficulty, whilst rewarding the player with the means to cut out monotonous tasks and you have a game.