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[electrolyte]

Hey all

Been a while since I've posted. I've kinda got lost down a design rabbit hole with something that's proving a challenge. The design of the game has been to explore, collect and solve puzzles. However for a while and as I've chatted to people about the game shape it feels like there's a big bit missing and that's combat.

Currently the caretaker robots do attempt to attack and your only course is to avoid / run. However this leaves the agency very much in the games hands.

Question I've been asking is what kind of combat shape fits the game? I don't think full out run around hack and slash works due to its room based nature. I was then looking at RPG styled play - I've never played one

Like a turn based, numbers based thing? Attack, defend ... Erm, heal? Also where would skill fit into the shape?


Thoughts on a postcard.

[JobLeonard]

Does the game need combat? I feel like it's something people tend to add to games by default without really asking if it's really necessary for the gameplay

[electrolyte]

Yeah totally and I think that's been the base of the challenge having worked on it for a couple of years - I never designed it to have combat.

I think you're right when it comes to combat in a traditional sense, running around, dodging etc. The games strong collect and solve which I guess is where I'm going with a more slower, considered ... even puzzle like in nature?

A throttling mechanic for the flow of the game, almost treating it as a gating system. I guess this is a due diligence process on the current design

[vdapps]

Hmm, your game is ATMOSPHERIC. First, what comes to my mind with relation to your game and encounters with enemies.. are SOMA like encounters, not a combat.

I'm not missing combats in your game and I'm questioning if it will not substract from overall atmosphere. So maybe better than generic combats would be introduce encounters here and there, but player will know that those encounters will be almost always lethal, which will add to this terrific feeling. And introduce mechanics how to avoid or outsmart an enemy. If killing him, than maybe with environment, "adventure-like" killing (example: navigating him to puddle of oil and burn him by sparking it, etc..)

But I stress, IMO in your game is important to feel very weak and fragile, as one who doesn't stand a chance face-to-face, and not to be a killing machine like Doom-guy.

[Schrompf]

I concur, your game always appeared to me as if combat would only lessen its qualities. But if you insist, I could imagine a "fight of willpower" style of confrontation. If it's rare enough, it might be bearable.

So here's how I imagine it could work: at specific points of the game the player enters a room with some enemy in it. It's idling at some position, blocking a crucial path to progress. And when the player comes closer, it stylishly zooms in on the two and some weird hacking game commences where you solve an abstract flow puzzle or something like that, with the heads of the contrahents on each side.

[electrolyte]

Thanks all, super helpful and value your feedback. So interesting to get your take on it (again wood and trees moment for myself)

Yeah that sense of fragility is something that's present so even the term 'combat' doesn't sit that well I guess.

@schromof almost like those moments in a game where you have to pick a lock and some UI appears where you fiddle around with the twin sticks to line something up

Lots to chew over, I'm on paternity leave at the moment so my body clocks all over the place. Visuals speak louder than words so will timebox some thoughts / prototype in the weird hours and then put it to bed if it's not landing.

[electrolyte]

Hi all,

Spent longer on this than I originally planned! In between kid management and new baby activities managed to build a prototype ... which then turned into some worked up game art. Just really wanted to see how the game loop feels. I then ended up plugging this into Chapter 1 and 2 along with the new narrative engine that I'd built a few months ago.

I'm discovering that these combat elements work quite well as flow throttles - and can also be weaved into problem solving, i.e. the enemy is powered up and you could grind - but run the risk of defeat, or find the most effective item and use it as a weapon to deal more damage.

All items that you pick up have stats associated which affects the damage outcome.



The new narrative engine allows for multi-path narration and multiple choice selections



And here's the combat scene. The camera fades into this new scene that presents you against the enemy. As a player you can select an items from your inventory. Once selected the input 'pulse' bar is displayed showing the two target hit points you need to aim for. If you land both then you carry out the attack action, if not then it registers a miss.

With your turn completed, you then have to defend. Again, the pulse bar is displayed with one target hit point shown. If you land this target then you are successful in your defence, if you miss then the enemy plays out their attack animation and deals a blow.



A terrible gif showing the pulse bar and a final hit!

[Schrompf]

Hm. The art style looks great, and the narrative sure is a cool thing. But item? Grind? Really? I'm playing through Control right now, and I'm sooo annoyed by this item/mod/value system shoehorned into what would be a nice narrative horror/mystery story otherwise. Especially the "grind" part. The only way how the player notices that she's underleveled is that she repeatedly dies at the same enemy. Is this really an experience you want the player to have?

Please reconsider.

[JobLeonard]

Yeah the presentation is great, but I second the worry of adding "grind" to a game that seems to have so much to offer in terms of a more "pure" experience

[electrolyte]

Oh sorry think you're getting wrong end of stick from my bad description.

No Grinding, don't worry I would not want that! What I was trying to outline was some items can be more effective than others.

Yeah control is brutal!!