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[ஒழுக்கின்மை (Paul Eres)]

bmt-micro pays through mailed checks or wired bank transfers. i use checks.

i'm not sure about the credit cards because there is limited info. all i know is that there are a lot of people who can't use paypal who can use bmt-micro. i'm not sure why paypal rejects some cards that bmt allows, though.

also, if paypal were so clearly better than e-commerce services, why don't most indie games use paypal instead of things like bmt-micro, plimus, fastspring, and e-sellerate? it seems like this discussion has occurred dozens of times on this and other forums, and 9 times out of 10 the person arguing for paypal hasn't ever sold games, and is just doing the calculations in theory, without realizing how important all the other stuff is. although to be fair there are one or two indie devs who only use paypal, but they're the exception.

[kometbomb]

That's a lot of interesting discussion, thank you. I have never had any problems paying via PayPal and it has worked over here (Finland) even without a credit card since they have contracts with some banks.

For me, PP is quite attractive because it's sort of more indie to do even the billing yourself and I like doing stuff like that. Of course, if that really translates to less sales it's a bit less attractive and it would suck if I couldn't buy something just because of I was born in the wrong country. Which, I guess, is pretty much the same as not supporting platform X that has some marginal but still existing demographic.

[ஒழுக்கின்மை (Paul Eres)]

how the heck is using paypal "more indie" when companies like fastspring and bmt-micro are small companies with only a few employees, and paypal is an international corporation with thousands of employees, and owned by ebay, which is even larger? and someone is still processing your orders either way, it's not like using paypal is any more direct.

[kometbomb]

Well, indie as in not dependent on something.

I guess DIY is closer to what I mean, but here goes: using PayPal or Google Checkout or whatever and not relying on a complete solution is more independent in the sense that the parts of the whole sale process are interchangeable with similar parts. So you will always have options if something changes to something you do not like. You will obviously never completely eliminate The Man.

But like I said, DIY is probably what I mean and is at least half of the attraction in not choosing a ready package.

[Perrin]

Doesn't make a lot of sense to me as per Paul's points. Why make more work for yourself just so you can support a massive corporation instead of taking a more packaged solution from a tiny company.

[Over00]

Doesn't make a lot of sense to me as per Paul's points. Why make more work for yourself just so you can support a massive corporation instead of taking a more packaged solution from a tiny company.

Some people just like to handle all the work. I don't think it's related to the definition of "indie" or anything.

It doesn't give something more. That's just how people like to deal with things. You can't expect everyone to think alike.

[kometbomb]

It's about DIY like I said. You can adopt a child but making one is quite fun if you're into that sort of thing.

Besides, at least from a patented, Uneducated Hunch(tm) it doesn't really seem that much extra work. Add some potential ideas to that that would probably require the customers to register on my site for some extra features and you'll want as little form filling and limitations as possible.

I don't think it's possible not to support a massive corporation unless you only accept animal hides. The whole idea of choosing between a few equally capitalistic options making you a better person is probably the smartest thing marketing ever invented.

[Perrin]

Yeah it's true not everyone thinks alike. I've never totally understood the mentality of "I'm sure I can build this just as good" rather than relying on entirely functional off-the-shelf options. It's the kind of "not built here" programmer mentality I've never understood.

With all the million and one things involved in making and selling an indie game, adding some extra workload just for the heck of it makes no sense to me.

Also btw my real job is a web coder, I've built ecommerce systems. So I'm definitely getting a big smirk out of the understimations floating about here.

[Christian Knudsen]

If you're really good at PHP and the stuff required for making this stuff yourself, I can kinda understand wanting to do it yourself. It gives you more control and a sense of accomplishment (which, for me personally, is a big part of game development). I'd likely choose BMT Micro or Fastspring when/if I need to sell a game, but that's just because I wouldn't know where to start if I had to set it all up myself.

[kometbomb]

Nobody would ever accomplish anything if they knew they can do it (as someone smarter than me put it).

I'm seriously considering making a living -- or failing at that, which just makes it more interesting -- by creating and selling a game but even then it's very important for me to enjoy and amuse myself with what I'm doing. I have been programming for fun since I was a little kid so it's even a bit hard for me not to do things other people think is boring.

As for underestimating, I am willing to place a bet on that PayPal is really easy to integrate.