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Triplefox
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« Reply #40 on: December 16, 2009, 06:09:54 PM » |
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apparently he hired a programmer This is a great way to make yourself a debt slave. Consider how much four weeks of your own time costs. For reference, I'm comfortable at $1400/mo. as a bachelor with a small rental and no car - if I moved back in with the parents it would be more like $600/mo. But four weeks of a competent game programmer's undivided attention, done as a freelance contract, is going to start at around $3000(for an modest $36k yearly income) and probably go upwards, on top of what you spend for yourself. So for my "bachelor" situation I triple my monthly burn rate, and for someone with a more expensive lifestyle, dependents, mortgage, etc., it could still easily be adding 20% on top. You just don't want to swallow that kind of burden for a risky project like a game, regardless of how good it is. You're better off investing in yourself instead - spend your money on books, equipment and good food, and then start learning to "fake it till you make it" at each relevant discipline. Or if you want it done now, find backers or partners to offset the costs, split revenue, etc. |
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Melly
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« Reply #41 on: December 16, 2009, 06:32:17 PM » |
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The programmer was probably the biggest dick in this. I'm honestly curious as to who he is now, because he basically saw a man with too much ambition, ego and too little common sense, and took MASSIVE advantage of that fact to screw him out of 10 grand.
Seriously, it takes a special kind of dick to do that.
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exodus
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« Reply #42 on: December 16, 2009, 06:34:44 PM » |
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Melly, it's possible the programmer was ignorant of costs/social convention, but you've got a pretty high chance of being right.
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Melly
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« Reply #43 on: December 16, 2009, 06:36:13 PM » |
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Given the circunstances, I find ignorance very unlikely.
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Gregory
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« Reply #44 on: December 16, 2009, 07:23:51 PM » |
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The programmer was probably the biggest dick in this. I'm honestly curious as to who he is now, because he basically saw a man with too much ambition, ego and too little common sense, and took MASSIVE advantage of that fact to screw him out of 10 grand.
Seriously, it takes a special kind of dick to do that.
When I worked at an entry-level software development contract position, I earned $30 an hour minus benefits. With a 40 hour work week, that's $1200 dollars a week. If someone wanted to hire a beginning developer to do a four-week job, $5000 would be a reasonable sum. If the developer was an established freelancer with video game development experience, I wouldn't bat an eye at them asking for $8000 for the four weeks, leaving $2000 of the 10 grand for the designer's living and miscellaneous expenses. I don't see massive exploitation here. But maybe I was overpaid. |
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Kunal
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is feeling Bit.Core.Trippy
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« Reply #45 on: December 16, 2009, 07:43:17 PM » |
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The programmer was probably the biggest dick in this. I'm honestly curious as to who he is now, because he basically saw a man with too much ambition, ego and too little common sense, and took MASSIVE advantage of that fact to screw him out of 10 grand.
Seriously, it takes a special kind of dick to do that.
As long as the programmer didn't hold a gun to Adam's head, I don't see why you should blame him (Disclaimer; I'm not the programmer!). Considering that Adam believes his game was going to be a major hit, that 10,000$ was going to be spent no matter what. Either he would have spent it over a two month period, working on the art while the programmer did his stuff, or over a 10 month period while he taught himself XNA programming and did the art. I couldn't laugh at the story, just found it very sad. |
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team_q
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« Reply #46 on: December 16, 2009, 07:46:38 PM » |
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I think there are 2 people in the world who can make a living off XBLIG right now. If you aren't those 2 people, you probably shouldn't quit your day job.
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jwk5
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« Reply #47 on: December 16, 2009, 10:27:23 PM » |
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The programmer was probably the biggest dick in this. I'm honestly curious as to who he is now, because he basically saw a man with too much ambition, ego and too little common sense, and took MASSIVE advantage of that fact to screw him out of 10 grand.
Seriously, it takes a special kind of dick to do that.
The thing is, you can pay a good programmer to create a bad design, but it isn't going to equal a good game. It's like being paid to paint a house in an ugly color, just because the house is an ugly color doesn't mean you're a bad painter. Do you know for sure it wasn't the design that was bad, or sound and graphics? The other thing to consider is if someone offers you a lot of money to do a job, maybe more than you were expecting, are you really going to refuse it? How do you know he didn't approach the programmer with his design with the same level of ego that he approached his critics? You can't really blame the programmer for taking a good offer (though you can blame the programmer for bad programming, if that is the case). And finally, do you know for sure how much of that $10,000 was actually paid to the programmer? People with big a big ego aren't generally known for their generosity. For all you know the programmer could have been paid very little, with the remaining sum being spent on whatever else the designer wanted (including things not related to the project). I mean we all got bills and we all need to eat. I wouldn't go raising the pitchforks and torches just yet, it'd be better to get facts before pointing fingers. |
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William Broom
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« Reply #48 on: December 17, 2009, 12:41:57 AM » |
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Solution: Discover the programmer's name and e-stalk him.
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sergiocornaga
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« Reply #49 on: December 17, 2009, 02:53:03 AM » |
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This comments thread is hilarious when I forsake all empathy for those involved. The Meredith Katz poster is especially awesome, I sure was amused by how Coate continually called her a troll when from what I read she seemed nothing like one.
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Gainsworthy
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« Reply #50 on: December 17, 2009, 05:01:22 AM » |
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 Raigan Burns is a gorramn Gentleman of the highest order. That he even bothered to approach the situation with hope of talking Dr. Flytrap down is props enough. Bravo. AS I READ FURTHER: Oh, so Dr. Flytrap gets worse, not better! Silly me. AND JUST TO RE-ITERATE:I'll be happy to mail you your stupid Gamecube Wario World game, since you obviously only care about money and material goods. Some friend you are, won't even spend $5 on my game when you make $85,000 a year. Very good. Hope you get that game back, Cthulhlu. AND FINALLY: That's a great Interview with Derek, by the way!
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« Last Edit: December 17, 2009, 05:18:10 AM by Gainsworthy »
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s0
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« Reply #51 on: December 17, 2009, 05:41:07 AM » |
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Yeah, that's probably the best interview with Derek I've read. Shame the Crazy Flytrap Guy hijacked it.
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brog
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« Reply #52 on: December 17, 2009, 06:13:43 AM » |
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The programmer was probably the biggest dick in this. I'm honestly curious as to who he is now, because he basically saw a man with too much ambition, ego and too little common sense, and took MASSIVE advantage of that fact to screw him out of 10 grand.
Seriously, it takes a special kind of dick to do that.
It's not actually that uncommon a situation - crazy man with more money than sense has an 'idea', pays programmer to make it, idea was stupid and doomed to failure. Usually it's a rich businessman who can afford to fail though. Generally what happens is they try to hire some good programmers, the good programmers say "this project is stupid and doomed to fail, you clearly know nothing about the technology involved", and the businessman ignores them and keeps looking until he finds some noobs who barely graduated CS and don't know enough to realise it won't work either. It's not really a very fun position to be in - sure, they're getting paid, but some crazy person is demanding results, and the methods they're used to using for their CS assignments (wikipedia, google, asking one of the smarter students) aren't working because it's actually a very very difficult problem and they don't know it. I digress. But yeah, I expect it's more a mixture of ignorance and being really keen to get into the 'games industry' than dickery. He probably just jumped at the chance to actually have a job working as a game programmer. For all we know, he might even have warned the guy that it might not work out - it doesn't sound like he's very good at listening to criticism after all. |
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moi
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« Reply #55 on: December 17, 2009, 09:15:57 AM » |
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You all dissing the best game ever made. The joke is on you!   |
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subsystems subsystems subsystems
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Perrin
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« Reply #56 on: December 17, 2009, 09:48:15 AM » |
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You all dissing the best game ever made. The joke is on you! I heard it was better than all the crap platformers we love! |
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TheDustin
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« Reply #57 on: December 17, 2009, 09:53:27 AM » |
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 Wow. Apparently he's going to send a press release for us over at PTT; the thing is as far as I know none of the staff owns a 360 in the first place. I hope he doesn't nerd rage all over our site. 
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Melly
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« Reply #58 on: December 17, 2009, 10:07:00 AM » |
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Flytrap is the new Airship 2600.
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hatu
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« Reply #59 on: December 17, 2009, 10:45:26 AM » |
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Blaming the programmer is kind of dumb. Executing dumb ideas is what we get paid for. Sure you can question some things but Flytrap guy doesn't seem like the kind of guy who would listen to you.
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Player
