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April 24, 2014, 11:48:39 PM
TIGSource ForumsFeedbackDevLogsTHROWMAN (a collaboration between blademasterbobo and john sandoval)
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Author Topic: THROWMAN (a collaboration between blademasterbobo and john sandoval)  (Read 10875 times)
Blademasterbobo
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« on: August 22, 2012, 06:10:38 PM »

john sandnonval and blademasterbobo presennts: throwman

« Last Edit: February 22, 2013, 09:55:20 PM by Blademasterbobo » Logged

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Blademasterbobo
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« Reply #1 on: August 22, 2012, 06:11:12 PM »

Our Story So Far
or:
Why You Should Make the Game Before You Ask For Art, Dumbass:
A Cautionary Tale


Once upon a time, John Sandonoval and I found out that we go to the same stupid school, so we decided to make a game. The first game we made, a tribute to the monster king, was buried deep within the forums. We then attempted to make a real game, the story of which has been lost to a terrible and wondrous place, where pornography and pugs live together in harmony. Finally, we decided to try one more time. This time, the game would have a much smaller scope, and it wouldn't be based on what might be the shittiest series of video games ever made.

The game, we decided, would be based on an idea Xion and I came up with a few years ago when talking about what gimmick to use for an Ikiki platformer ripoff. One of us (I don't really remember who) suggested throwing different types of dudes, combined with the light stealth mechanics from Ikiki's games and the action-puzzle platforming.

Unfortunately, we started working on code and graphics for the game at the same time, which was ultimately about the dumbest thing we could've done. This version looked something like this mockup:



This version of the game actually made it pretty far. Most of the basic game mechanics were in, and a large number of the animations for the main enemies and the player were finished. You could grab dudes and throw them, interactive stuff was in, a few neat enemies were finished, and the "engine" was in a state that allowed me to add new enemies / items fairly quickly. We were messing around with some simple levels, although at this point in development, most of them ended up being crate puzzles, which are objectively the worst kind of puzzle.



Attempt 1


(Click the gif to view a larger version)

(Those lasers turned out bitchin, I'll be sad to see them go. Sad)


(Click the gif to view a larger version)

(You could "surf" enemies you grabbed to deal with the fall damage. Felt fun, but didn't really fit with the other mechanics, and I had to explain it 20 times whenever someone tested the game.)








(Some of the art assets for the old version)




The main problem with this version was that a large number of design choices were made to fit the art. This wouldn't be a problem, normally, but the original idea for the game didn't quite fit with the art style. In order to make the game feel more smooth, the design ended up being stretched in two separate directions, making the game feel bland and stale. The art would have worked well with a certain type of game, but not the one we originally set out to make. Another issue was that, while the game was small in scope, and the art style seemed simple at first glance, the number of animations required to add a new enemy or item kept increasing drastically. John's workload became higher than it should have been for such a simple idea.

I started bringing up these concerns to John (read: whined like a little babby), and, understandably, John was hesitant to scrap all of the work we (mostly he) had put into the game so far. I decided to throw together a prototype (!!!which I should have done in the first place!!!) to see if the original game I had in mind would be any more fun, or if it was less of a conflicted design issue and more of a "this game is just fucking boring" issue. I threw together a prototype in a few days, using about half of the old code, and without worrying about art considerations. This version felt much more coherent, it seemed like it would be easier to make content for, and it was more fun. After a bit of deliberation, we decided to remake the game in this fashion.



Attempt 2


(Yay programmer art! Bonus points to anyone who can guess wtf the stuff is.)


(Some of the new art, and a simple level.)


(Some of the art assets for the new version.)



Now we're working on this version of the game, and things are going a lot more smoothly, design wise. I've only been working on this new version for a few days, not counting the code from the first attempt, and John has only been working on the new art assets for a few hours today, but the game is already feeling better than the original. The takeaway from all of this is something that gets repeated all the time, but it bears repeating yet again: MAKE A FUCKING PROTOTYPE OF YOUR GAME FIRST. Most of these problems would have been avoided had I made a prototype of the game before John started working on art assets. Alas... that was not the case, and a few weeks worth of work ended up being wasted. (Although we might still use the art assets for another game down the road, who knows.) In the end, though, we didn't do that, and, although it was a hard decision to make, and it'll be some time before we can be 100% sure of this, I think that we made the right choice. It was better to deal with these problems (even if I caused them through stupidity) before it had gotten to the point where we were releasing a game that just... wasn't very good.

~
« Last Edit: August 22, 2012, 06:39:30 PM by Blademasterbobo » Logged

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John Sandoval
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« Reply #2 on: August 22, 2012, 06:12:53 PM »

(Those lasers turned out bitchin, I'll be sad to see them go. Sad)

we can just re-use them.... shhhh
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Ashkin
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« Reply #3 on: August 22, 2012, 06:21:04 PM »

I am interested in being manly and throwing things.
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_Madk
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« Reply #4 on: August 22, 2012, 06:27:30 PM »

I approve of this devlog
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Magnesium Ninja
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« Reply #5 on: August 22, 2012, 07:14:24 PM »

I too am interested in being a man and partaking in the tossing of certain objects.
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eyeliner
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« Reply #6 on: August 23, 2012, 12:48:56 AM »

The art in the first screens is amazing.
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Yeah.
Gabriel Verdon
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« Reply #7 on: August 23, 2012, 01:11:44 AM »

This is so cool!

Edit: By the way, how do you guys make those GIFs? I've seen Xion make some too for his game and they are really cool. Do you use a screen recorder and then export the video as a gif?

Edit2: Nevermind, figured it out!
« Last Edit: August 23, 2012, 01:26:58 AM by Gabriel Verdon » Logged

DustyDrake
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« Reply #8 on: August 23, 2012, 01:53:01 AM »

But the old art was amaaaazing...
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moi
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« Reply #9 on: August 23, 2012, 08:42:49 AM »

This is so cool!

Edit: By the way, how do you guys make those GIFs? I've seen Xion make some too for his game and they are really cool. Do you use a screen recorder and then export the video as a gif?


I uploaded today another video on how to upload animated GIF's using LICEcap and shoeBox's upload to Flickr feature. LiceCap is a neat little free tool (mac & pc) that lets you create little animated GIF files from anywhere on your computer screen.
http://www.cockos.com/licecap/

(...)
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subsystems   subsystems   subsystems
Evan McClane
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« Reply #10 on: August 23, 2012, 08:58:32 AM »

gota throw fsat
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Blademasterbobo
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« Reply #11 on: August 23, 2012, 09:08:25 AM »

This is so cool!

Edit: By the way, how do you guys make those GIFs? I've seen Xion make some too for his game and they are really cool. Do you use a screen recorder and then export the video as a gif?

Edit2: Nevermind, figured it out!

Just in case anyone else was wondering: I used fraps to record the video (and the standalone flash projector, so fraps would actually record it.) Then I used virtualdub to pick the segment to export, and I exported it as a series of images. Finally, I used GIF Construction Set to make the gifs. Fraps recorded at 60fps, so I cut out half the frames in GCS, and voila. vdub has a gif export option, but the gifs it exported were all glitchy for me.

edit: xion does them differently, tho. he has something in the game he turns on that exports each frame as a png, and then he stitches those together.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2012, 09:22:03 AM by Blademasterbobo » Logged

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wademcgillis
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« Reply #12 on: August 23, 2012, 09:20:25 AM »

fsat no mor


Looking good.
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seagaia
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this is okay


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« Reply #13 on: August 23, 2012, 09:23:27 AM »

i am loving the programmer art
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_Madk
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« Reply #14 on: August 23, 2012, 09:35:41 AM »

This is so cool!

Edit: By the way, how do you guys make those GIFs? I've seen Xion make some too for his game and they are really cool. Do you use a screen recorder and then export the video as a gif?

Edit2: Nevermind, figured it out!

also there's me who just went and wrote the code to do it myself
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