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[bigosaur]

Hi,

Last November I was looking for a new puzzle platformer game to play after completing Braid, Fez, VVVVVV and Limbo. I found some games, but none had really challenging puzzles. So I decided to build one.



I'm 5 months into development, and here's my first demo. It's a complete first chapter of the game.

What works:

- custom 2D platforming engine
- about 20 puzzles in single player mode
- a couple of co-op puzzles to show how it works
- keyboard and controller configuration
- nice pixel graphics
- level editor

What's missing:

- more levels
- music and sound effects

The game is built with C++, SDL2 and Box2D library


Download Demo for Windows:

http://bigosaur.com/seeders-build2-setup.exe


If you're interested in Linux or Mac builds, let me know. I can only make 64bit builds at this time and Linux one will be built on Ubuntu 14.04.


If you want to see some screenshots/video before trying, it's all on my Steam Greenlight page:

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=403676516

ANY feedback is welcome.

Thanks.

[Quicksand-S]

I like the look of it, and I often enjoy puzzle platformers. Any chance of version without an installer? When it comes to testing small games (potentially multiple versions of the same game), an installer isn't really ideal.

[bigosaur]

I like the look of it, and I often enjoy puzzle platformers. Any chance of version without an installer? When it comes to testing small games (potentially multiple versions of the same game), an installer isn't really ideal.

Sure. Here it is (about 7MB):

http://bigosaur.com/seeders-0.91-windows.zip

Let me know if it works.

[fingerman]

Hi bigosaur!

This really looks impressive. I rushed my way through the intro story to get down to business.
The visuals, especially the background look very good but don't distract from the foreground gameplay.
Nice concept, the way gameplay mechanics are introduced via the billboards and the grafiti.
The controls are very smooth also.

Is it intentional that you only get to keep a hat if you make it to the following checkpoint?
Soundeffects will obviously add a lot.

[Quicksand-S]

Archive version works fine. Thanks.

-Why does the camera start off to the bottom right when I start the game? If that's intentional (to introduce the skate park gradually) then maybe it should be a slower movement.

-The first thing I did was click the menu item I wanted and realize that the mouse doesn't work despite it being a PC game. It's always nice to have the option to use the mouse in menus even when the bulk of the game doesn't use it.

-For the most part, the writing is good. There are a lot of commas that should really be periods, though.

-A way to speed up dialogue without skipping the cutscene entirely would be nice.

-I wasn't a fan of the part right after the first checkpoint. Being forced to take things slowly and wait for the camera to show me what was down there wasn't particularly fun. I just wanted to move on.

-The speed of the game is surprisingly low overall. The intro shows off this high-speed skateboard, but when you play you move more slowly than even a manual skateboard does.

-This is just personal preference, but I hate it when platformers make me keep jumping if I hold the jump key. I'm used to games that change my jump height depending on how long I hold the button, so I'm often still holding it when I reach a platform.

-If a grey block is resting on a green block and I push the pair of objects into a place where the top one is blocked, the bottom one stops moving too.

I stopped playing at the sawblades because I messed up and didn't want to do the entire thing over again. There's too much waiting involved in that puzzle and it seems like the sort of thing where you have to know what's going on before you attempt it (but you can't because of time and camera constraints). Personally, I'd like a checkpoint just before the sawblade part.

I really like the environment art. It looks great.

[bigosaur]

-Why does the camera start off to the bottom right when I start the game? If that's intentional (to introduce the skate park gradually) then maybe it should be a slower movement.

I didn't really think about it until now. Yes, gradual introduction of the skate park would be best.

-The first thing I did was click the menu item I wanted and realize that the mouse doesn't work despite it being a PC game. It's always nice to have the option to use the mouse in menus even when the bulk of the game doesn't use it.

Ok, I believe it will be trivial to fix this. The game does use the mouse in the editor anyway.

-For the most part, the writing is good. There are a lot of commas that should really be periods, though.

I'm not a native English speaker, so I'll take this as a huge compliment. Will fix those commas. 

-A way to speed up dialogue without skipping the cutscene entirely would be nice.

I'm not sure what you mean? How would that work?

-I wasn't a fan of the part right after the first checkpoint. Being forced to take things slowly and wait for the camera to show me what was down there wasn't particularly fun. I just wanted to move on.

-The speed of the game is surprisingly low overall. The intro shows off this high-speed skateboard, but when you play you move more slowly than even a manual skateboard does.

The game is meant to be a slow, relaxing, logical puzzler and platforming part is only a medium. But I understand that many players will come into the game with different expectations. I experimented with bumping the speed to 100 FPS, which makes it more fluid, but once you get to the more complicated puzzles it becomes much harder to play. The way I see it, there's two options: either to have this 100FPS/60FPS setting or introduce some kind of "boost" that you can activate during the game (like walk/run that some games have).

I stopped playing at the sawblades because I messed up and didn't want to do the entire thing over again. There's too much waiting involved in that puzzle and it seems like the sort of thing where you have to know what's going on before you attempt it (but you can't because of time and camera constraints). Personally, I'd like a checkpoint just before the sawblade part.

I could add another checkpoint at the top of the elevator.

I really like the environment art. It looks great.

Excellent feedback. Thank you.

[bigosaur]

Is it intentional that you only get to keep a hat if you make it to the following checkpoint?

Yes. The puzzles are built that way that you have to take the hat and survive.

Hats are completely optional though. They are meant for players who want an extra challenge.

Thanks.

[Quicksand-S]

-A way to speed up dialogue without skipping the cutscene entirely would be nice.

I'm not sure what you mean? How would that work?

A lot of games let the player press a key to instantly show the next bit of dialogue. It gets a bit trickier if you want to also let players skip the animations too (like skaters rolling over to the group) but you might be able to get away with leaving that stuff as-is.

The game is meant to be a slow, relaxing, logical puzzler

I didn't find it that relaxing when the forklift was about to go off a cliff and force me to redo a whole section, but yeah, the earlier stuff was pretty relaxing.

The way I see it, there's two options: either to have this 100FPS/60FPS setting or introduce some kind of "boost" that you can activate during the game (like walk/run that some games have).

A third option would be to adjust the initial cutscene. I'm pretty sure that the main reason I wanted and expected it to be faster was that the cutscene showed a rocket-powered skateboard moving at high speed. The actual movement speed in-game works just fine, but it felt slow in comparison to what I'd been made to expect.

Personally, I'd like a checkpoint just before the sawblade part.

I could add another checkpoint at the top of the elevator.

I'm not sure which elevator you're talking about. If you mean the one that comes right after a checkpoint, I'm not sure what the point of a second checkpoint at the top would be. I'm thinking more along the lines of having one down near the switch that lets the forklift move into the sawblade room. That way the player doesn't have to go and push a block, ride an elevator, jump on a forklift, push another block, push yet another block, wait, push one of the previous blocks and jump over spikes if they mess up or take too long with the sawblade area. It's not that hard, but in my opinion the number of relatively actions you need to perform if you do manage to die there is too high.

I tend to think that a puzzle (especially one that takes more than two or three steps, or one that involves waiting for something that's out of the player's control) should only have to be done once. If you know the solution and have already solved it then it's just boring to do it again.


A couple more thoughts/questions:

-Why is X the reset key rather than R like most games? If I die in a game like this, my reflex is to reach for the R key.

-It's a bit weird that riding on a forklift doesn't actually move the player character. Any plans to make the forklift's movement actually affect the player?

-That puzzle right after the first sawblade section (the pit that you have to get out of) was great. It didn't take long to figure out, but my first thought was complete confusion. It was kinda funny to realize that the solution was so simple and obvious (although the physics didn't work as expected the first time I attempted it, for some reason).

[bigosaur]

I'm thinking more along the lines of having one down near the switch that lets the forklift move into the sawblade room.

The problem with this is that you can get to that switch without opening the door for the forklift to come down, so you would get a saved checkpoint with a situation that is unsolvable and you would have to play the whole game from start.

Unlike some other games, in Seeders the checkpoint saves the state of every object in the world, so when you load the checkpoint, everything is exactly where it was when it was saved.

-Why is X the reset key rather than R like most games?

I assume that many players would play with xbox 360 controller and wanted to keep the in-game text fixed, especially the graffiti that are not generated, but edited manually. The only common keys that xbox controller shares with a keyboard are X, Y, A and B and I picked X out of those four.

BTW, you can easily rebind the restart key to any other in the settings (this works).

-It's a bit weird that riding on a forklift doesn't actually move the player character. Any plans to make the forklift's movement actually affect the player?

Yes. I already tried by changing the friction on the player, but when I changed that some other parts of the game started to act weird. It should be fixed in the final game, although, there are two puzzles where changing this would make the puzzle different. Once I fix it, I'll have to test to see which is better.

-That puzzle right after the first sawblade section (the pit that you have to get out of) was great. It didn't take long to figure out, but my first thought was complete confusion.

Exactly what I was trying to accomplish. I wanted the player to stop and think: "What the ...?"

Thanks.

[Quicksand-S]

The problem with this is that you can get to that switch without opening the door for the forklift to come down, so you would get a saved checkpoint with a situation that is unsolvable and you would have to play the whole game from start.

That's a good point. Maybe the puzzle could be tweaked a bit to keep that from being possible? For example, the path for the player to get down to the lower area could be blocked until the forklift presses a button or pushes something on its way down.

[bigosaur]

That's a good point. Maybe the puzzle could be tweaked a bit to keep that from being possible? For example, the path for the player to get down to the lower area could be blocked until the forklift presses a button or pushes something on its way down.

Actually, the puzzle did work like that initially (without checkpoint though), but I felt like there were too many buttons and doors and removed it. Maybe it would be better to get it back. Thanks for the idea.

[Qrchack]

I feel like the player movement speed is way too slow. Also, did you get my email? I mailed you to your profile email.

[bigosaur]

I feel like the player movement speed is way too slow.

Yes, many players say that. But it should wear off soon as puzzles get more complicated and precision is needed. I tried speeding up the player and then some things get much harder to execute... I'm still not sure how to solve this problem.

Also, did you get my email? I mailed you to your profile email.

I don't think I did. You can e-mail me directly at: info [at] bigosaur.comm.

[Terrytheplatypus]

"Find Secret Areas!" I didn't like that, because secret areas, are ,y'know, secret? For the speed stuff, you could make a button to toggle between two speeds.

[Terrytheplatypus]

looks nice, though, i'll check it out as soon as I'm not busy with stuff

[harkme]

I was a little disappointed when I stood on the edge and my character was stiff as a board. After seeing the intro of characters on the ramp, I thought my own character would follow those physics. Heck, the boxes do!

[Quicksand-S]

Yes, many players say that. But it should wear off soon as puzzles get more complicated and precision is needed. I tried speeding up the player and then some things get much harder to execute... I'm still not sure how to solve this problem.

Maybe a higher top speed, but fairly slow acceleration so players can still fine-tune their positions if necessary?

Instead of slow acceleration, you could have the player only start accelerating from the normal speed to max speed after they've been moving in the same direction for a certain amount of time. That way the higher speed only activates when moving long distances.

Another option, which might be a bit weird, would be to have the player choose their top speed at any time (I imagine a slider of some sort, controlled by keys/buttons or mouse, but it could be done in many different ways).

[bigosaur]

"Find Secret Areas!" I didn't like that, because secret areas, are ,y'know, secret?

The secret areas are completely optional (only if you want to collect all the hats).

For the speed stuff, you could make a button to toggle between two speeds.

Looks like I will have to go that way. Maybe a "boost" button. I never understood why games like Mario had the "run" button when it was rarely required to use it. Now I'm starting to.

Thanks.

[wessles]

You've done a good job of this game so far, but there are a few things execution-wise that I think you could improve on:

• Make the sprites more alive. This is important. You have to make sure that the people look like humans, not skateboarding cardboard cutouts. Make their arms move down if they are accelerating upwards, or make them squat slightly as they land on something. It's little things like this that make the overall game look better.
• I skipped a cutscene, but it took me a while to realize I was in-game. Maybe add in an indicator that there is a cutscene, like black bars on the top and bottom. Look at how Hotline Miami did it: the player goes in, sees the bars, and knows it's a cutscene. They wait until the bars recede, and they know they can move again. The player needs some indication that the game has started again.
• Make the graffiti font more readable. This is a minor complaint, but it's hard to read with cryptic rainbow typography like this:
  

I like the work you put into the art, and look forward to seeing where this game goes. Thank you for making this!

[bigosaur]

Make the sprites more alive. This is important. You have to make sure that the people look like humans, not skateboarding cardboard cutouts. Make their arms move down if they are accelerating upwards, or make them squat slightly as they land on something. It's little things like this that make the overall game look better.

Actually one of the arms does move down and the front of the skateboard raises when you jump, but I guess I need to make it stronger and also improve other animation. This is my first project with pixel art, so I'm still learning.

like black bars on the top and bottom

Yes, I've seen many games do that (Broforce, Castle Crashers come to mind). I did try to hint that the game is about to start by turning the player to face right, but this does not happen when you skip the cut scene. I will add the bars, it's much simpler solution and works for all cut scenes. Thanks.

Make the graffiti font more readable. This is a minor complaint, but it's hard to read with cryptic rainbow typography like this:
[/li][/list]

Since the "press X to restart" has been explained elsewhere (dialog at the first phone booth and also X mark below checkpoints) I really wanted to replicate real-world graffiti, which are often just as readable as the graphics I used

Thanks for all your comments. I really appreciate it.