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[InfiniteStateMachine]

Hey man I just tried this for the first time. It's great fun. I missed a Data Communications class because of this

Is it possible to get a new minion after your current one dies? I'm guessing maybe you find one in a treasure box but I havent come across this yet. I'm sure this has been asked before but I didn't see it in the insructions and this thread has 100 pages o_0

[st33d]

Glad you're having fun 

The minion comes from the Underworld. A portal to that place can be opened by killing a monster that has had Undead cast upon it (via throwing a rune or an Undead enchanted weapon).

There is also a portal rune that can open a way to the Underworld.

And if all else fails, the Underworld portal starts off on level 20. All other methods actually move the original portal to a new location.

spoilers

[st33d]

Editor Update 317

Added a teleport minion option to the editor menu (just click whilst over that option to teleport the minion), and drawing the ai paths that characters are using to navigate.

This helped me solve a bug where characters were being added multiple times to the AI queue - so there were a number of ghosts the minion may have been chasing.

AI problems

I'm now concentrating on trying to fix the AI.

There are four major issues here:

No Clip Handling: Characters that are overlapping their targets don't know what to do about it. They've reached the goal but can't attack it.

The Navigation Path is Too Long: When this happens a character will walk to the nearest possible tile to the goal and stop. A common occurrence of this is when two characters face off at each other on top of two cliffs. They will simply stare each other out because they can't solve a route that long. This is often how the minion will get stranded. You can tell in the editor view when this happens - they will have one node in their path and they will stand perfectly still.

Someone In The Way: A chasing monster often runs into a patrolling monster and can't get him to move out of the way.

Two Paths of Equal Length: A character will get stuck trying to choose between two options and constantly turn left or right.

-

The others I have ideas on how to solve. The last one, even with all my new editing tools and test bed, I can't recreate. But I've seen it before.

If you see this last issue and can post a screenshot of it (with the ai paths on in the editor helps immensely) please do.

After solving these problems I hope to implement Bravery stats (monsters will attack and run away), exploration states (monsters will get bored and investigate other areas whilst patrolling) and the Fear spell.

[mokesmoe]

The AI thinks this is a valid path. This isn't something that would come up in normal play though.


Also the AI path won't let the AI drop off anything that isn't a ledge. They can't walk off the side of a block or drop off the bottom of a ladder. Again, wont come up in any normal dungeon, So not a problem.

Also my "Remap AI graph" option stopped working. I had died and started a new game before it happened, although I hap already reamapped it once before it stopped working.



There you go, another post filled with glitches that don't need to be fixed.

[st33d]

Having path rendering on and entering the Test Bed crashes it. Best to just turn off any editor rendering before changing levels.

The level generator actually never leaves a cliff edge without a ledge sticking out from it. I did that because of all the trouble I was having with map connectivity but it also served as an optimisation for creating the AI graph. Yay for blundering.

Editor Update 318

Added patrol path rendering to editor ai render, added tile postition to ai render, added main-dungeon lighting or area lighting setting to test bed, added rendering parent colliders to editor, added coords to editor highlight rect.

Fun with the new lighting options in the Test Bed (you have to restart the Test Bed to see them):



You can see the new rakshasa and wizard hat in there.

New AI

To solve the path-finding dead-end problem, characters now panic. On reaching their wits end with their path finding routines they will pick a node at random to navigate to nearby and try going there to see if they can figure out a new route.

It doesn't work for everything, but now, on a cliff edge facing the enemy, the ai will chance a leap of faith.

I'm going to work on more AI features now.

[st33d]

I stunned Death

[st33d]

Okay, I'm noting 3038913370 as a good one.

Code:

WELCOME ROGUE
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY ROGUE
ROGUE TORE OUT A KOBOLD HEART
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY ROGUE
ROGUE TORE OUT A KOBOLD HEART
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY THE MINION
PICKED UP RUNE OF ?
PICKED UP FLIES
KOBOLD DECAPITATED BY ROGUE
KOBOLD DECAPITATED BY THE MINION
BEGINNING SEARCH, PLEASE STAY STILL...
SEARCH COMPLETE
3 DISCOVERIES
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY THE MINION
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY THE MINION
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY THE MINION
PICKED UP KNIFE
MINION EATS KOBOLD HEART
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY THE MINION
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY ROGUE
TRAP DISARMED
SECRET REVEALED
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY ROGUE
TRAP DISARMED
KOBOLD DECAPITATED BY ROGUE
BEGINNING SEARCH, PLEASE STAY STILL...
SEARCH COMPLETE
FOUND NOTHING
DESCENDED TO LEVEL 2
SAVED GAME DATA
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY ROGUE
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY QUICKENING
GOBLIN STOPPED BY QUICKENING
GOBLIN STOPPED BY QUICKENING
WELCOME TO LEVEL 2 ROGUE
GOBLIN STOPPED BY ROGUE
EQUIPMENT IS NOW IN ORDER OF PURPOSE
PICKED UP RUNE OF ?
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY THE MINION
GOBLIN STOPPED BY THE MINION
TELEPORT TRAP TRIGGERED
TELEPORT DART HITS ROGUE
BEGINNING SEARCH, PLEASE STAY STILL...
SEARCH ABANDONED
1 DISCOVERY
GOBLIN STOPPED BY THE MINION
BEGINNING SEARCH, PLEASE STAY STILL...
SEARCH COMPLETE
2 DISCOVERIES
PICKED UP TIARA
PICKED UP RUNE OF ?
GOBLIN STOPPED BY THE MINION
GOBLIN STOPPED BY QUICKENING
WELCOME TO LEVEL 3 ROGUE
TRAP DISARMED
TRAP DISARMED
TRAP DISARMED
GOBLIN STOPPED BY ROGUE
PICKED UP TIARA
GOBLIN STOPPED BY ROGUE
GOBLIN STOPPED BY THE MINION
SECRET REVEALED
KOBOLD DECAPITATED BY THE MINION
GOBLIN STOPPED BY ROGUE
DESCENDED TO LEVEL 3
SAVED GAME DATA
BEGINNING SEARCH, PLEASE STAY STILL...
SEARCH COMPLETE
4 DISCOVERIES
TRAP DISARMED
WELCOME TO LEVEL 4 ROGUE
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY THE MINION
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY THE MINION
BEGINNING SEARCH, PLEASE STAY STILL...
SEARCH COMPLETE
FOUND NOTHING
SECRET REVEALED
PICKED UP RUNE OF ?
PICKED UP FEDORA
PICKED UP RUNE OF ?
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY ROGUE
ROGUE TORE OUT A KOBOLD HEART
TRAP DISARMED
BEGINNING SEARCH, PLEASE STAY STILL...
SEARCH COMPLETE
2 DISCOVERIES
TRAP DISARMED
ORC BEAT BY ROGUE
EQUIPMENT IS NOW IN ORDER OF PURPOSE
ORC BEAT BY ROGUE
GOBLIN STOPPED BY ROGUE
BEGINNING SEARCH, PLEASE STAY STILL...
SEARCH COMPLETE
FOUND NOTHING
GOBLIN STOPPED BY ROGUE
PICKED UP DAGGER
PICKED UP TIARA
GOBLIN DECAPITATED BY THE MINION
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY THE MINION
TRAP DISARMED
GOBLIN STOPPED BY THE MINION
ORC BEAT BY ROGUE
PIT TRAP TRIGGERED
ORC BEAT BY THE MINION
BEGINNING SEARCH, PLEASE STAY STILL...
SEARCH COMPLETE
FOUND NOTHING
TRAP DISARMED
ORC BEAT BY ROGUE
ORC BEAT BY THE MINION
WELCOME TO LEVEL 5 ROGUE
DESCENDED TO LEVEL 4
SAVED GAME DATA
TROLL GUTTED BY ROGUE
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY THE MINION
GOBLIN STOPPED BY ROGUE
ROGUE TORE OUT A GOBLIN HEART
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY ROGUE
BEGINNING SEARCH, PLEASE STAY STILL...
SEARCH COMPLETE
4 DISCOVERIES
TRAP DISARMED
EQUIPMENT IS NOW IN ORDER OF PURPOSE
TROLL GUTTED BY ROGUE
ORC BEAT BY ROGUE
BEGINNING SEARCH, PLEASE STAY STILL...
SEARCH COMPLETE
3 DISCOVERIES
THE MINION SMASHED BY ORC
ORC BEAT BY ROGUE
ROGUE TORE OUT AN ORC HEART
KOBOLD DECAPITATED BY ROGUE
ROGUE TORE OUT A KOBOLD HEART
A KOBOLD FACE IS CREATED
PICKED UP KOBOLD FACE
PICKED UP RUNE OF ?
PICKED UP MACE
TRAP DISARMED
TRAP DISARMED
PICKED UP DAGGER
SECRET REVEALED
GOBLIN STOPPED BY ROGUE
GOBLIN STOPPED BY ROGUE
PICKED UP RUNE OF ?
PICKED UP RUNE OF ?
TRAP DISARMED
BEGINNING SEARCH, PLEASE STAY STILL...
SEARCH COMPLETE
FOUND NOTHING
ORC BEAT BY ROGUE
ORC BEAT BY ROGUE
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY ROGUE
ORC BEAT BY ROGUE
PICKED UP TIARA
EQUIPMENT IS NOW IN ORDER OF PURPOSE
W: FEDORA ENCHANTED WITH RUNE OF HEAL
W: + FEDORA ENCHANTED WITH RUNE OF HEAL
W: + FEDORA ENCHANTED WITH RUNE OF LIGHT
W: + FEDORA ENCHANTED WITH RUNE OF LIGHT
W: + FEDORA ENCHANTED WITH RUNE OF LIGHT
W: + FEDORA ENCHANTED WITH RUNE OF LIGHT
ROGUE EATS ORC HEART
ORC BEAT BY ROGUE
PICKED UP DAGGER
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY ROGUE
PICKED UP DAGGER
TROLL GUTTED BY ROGUE
PICKED UP DAGGER
TRAP DISARMED
GOBLIN STOPPED BY ROGUE
TRAP DISARMED
TROLL GUTTED BY ROGUE
BEGINNING SEARCH, PLEASE STAY STILL...
SEARCH COMPLETE
2 DISCOVERIES
TRAP DISARMED
TRAP DISARMED
WELCOME TO LEVEL 6 ROGUE
DESCENDED TO LEVEL 5
SAVED GAME DATA
GNOLL ROBBED BY ROGUE
BEGINNING SEARCH, PLEASE STAY STILL...
SEARCH COMPLETE
5 DISCOVERIES
TRAP DISARMED
GOBLIN STOPPED BY ROGUE
ORC BEAT BY ROGUE
ROGUE TORE OUT AN ORC HEART
PICKED UP DAGGER
TRAP DISARMED
GNOLL ROBBED BY ROGUE
PICKED UP DAGGER
TRAP DISARMED
ROGUE EATS ORC HEART
ORC BEAT BY ROGUE
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY ROGUE
ORC BEAT BY ROGUE
GNOLL ROBBED BY ROGUE
GOBLIN STOPPED BY ROGUE
GNOLL DECAPITATED BY ROGUE
TRAP DISARMED
BEGINNING SEARCH, PLEASE STAY STILL...
SEARCH COMPLETE
6 DISCOVERIES
TRAP DISARMED
TRAP DISARMED
TRAP DISARMED
TRAP DISARMED
TRAP DISARMED
ORC BEAT BY ROGUE
SECRET REVEALED
BEGINNING SEARCH, PLEASE STAY STILL...
SEARCH COMPLETE
FOUND NOTHING
ROGUE EATS GOBLIN HEART
ROGUE EATS KOBOLD HEART
ROGUE EATS KOBOLD HEART
TRAP DISARMED
ORC BEAT BY ROGUE
PICKED UP RUNE OF ?
PICKED UP RUNE OF HEAL
W: + FEDORA ENCHANTED WITH RUNE OF HEAL
GNOLL DECAPITATED BY ROGUE
GNOLL ROBBED BY ROGUE
TROLL GUTTED BY ROGUE
ORC BEAT BY ROGUE
ORC BEAT BY ROGUE
TROLL GUTTED BY ROGUE
ROGUE TORE OUT A TROLL HEART
TROLL GUTTED BY ROGUE
PICKED UP + TOP HAT
PICKED UP RUNE OF ?
PICKED UP RUNE OF ?
EQUIPMENT IS NOW IN ORDER OF PURPOSE
GOBLIN STOPPED BY ROGUE
TROLL DECAPITATED BY ROGUE
A TROLL FACE IS CREATED
PICKED UP TROLL FACE
TROLL GUTTED BY ROGUE
PICKED UP + FIRE FLIES
PICKED UP + FLIES
GNOLL ROBBED BY ROGUE
DESCENDED TO LEVEL 6
SAVED GAME DATA
TROLL GUTTED BY ROGUE
ROGUE TORE OUT A TROLL HEART
PIT TRAP TRIGGERED
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY ROGUE
DROW BLINDED BY ROGUE
GNOLL ROBBED BY ROGUE
BEGINNING SEARCH, PLEASE STAY STILL...
SEARCH COMPLETE
4 DISCOVERIES
TROLL GUTTED BY ROGUE
PIT TRAP TRIGGERED
BEGINNING SEARCH, PLEASE STAY STILL...
SEARCH COMPLETE
2 DISCOVERIES
PICKED UP RUNE OF IDENTIFY
PICKED UP RUNE OF HEAL
ROGUE EATS RUNE OF IDENTIFY
EQUIPMENT IS NOW IN ORDER OF PURPOSE
W: MACE ENCHANTED WITH RUNE OF UNDEAD
W: + MACE ENCHANTED WITH RUNE OF UNDEAD
TRAP DISARMED
SECRET REVEALED
WELCOME TO LEVEL 7 ROGUE
TELEPORT TRAP TRIGGERED
TELEPORT DART HITS ROGUE
TRAP DISARMED
DROW BLINDED BY ROGUE
ROGUE TORE OUT A DROW HEART
DROW BLINDED BY ROGUE
ROGUE TORE OUT A DROW HEART
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY ROGUE
PICKED UP DAGGER
GOBLIN STOPPED BY ROGUE
TRAP DISARMED
TROLL GUTTED BY ROGUE
PICKED UP DAGGER
PICKED UP RUNE OF ?
PICKED UP RUNE OF UNDEAD
W: + MACE ENCHANTED WITH RUNE OF UNDEAD
BEGINNING SEARCH, PLEASE STAY STILL...
SEARCH COMPLETE
6 DISCOVERIES
TROLL DECAPITATED BY ROGUE
PICKED UP TIARA
A TROLL FACE IS CREATED
PICKED UP TROLL FACE
GNOLL ROBBED BY ROGUE
THE UNDERWORLD PORTAL IS OPENED BY THIS SACRIFICE
UNDEAD MINION RETURNS
GNOLL ROBBED BY THE MINION
EQUIPMENT IS NOW IN ORDER OF PURPOSE
GNOLL ROBBED BY ROGUE
THE MINION IS HEALED BY THIS SACRIFICE
TRAP DISARMED
TRAP DISARMED
TRAP DISARMED
DROW BLINDED BY THE MINION
THE MINION DECAPITATED BY DROW
UNDEAD MINION RETURNS
DROW BLINDED BY ROGUE
GOBLIN STOPPED BY ROGUE
DROW BLINDED BY ROGUE
TRAPS DISARMED
TRAP DISARMED
GNOLL ROBBED BY ROGUE
GNOLL ROBBED BY THE MINION
PICKED UP + TIARA
PICKED UP + HALO
PICKED UP + HALO
EQUIPMENT IS NOW IN ORDER OF PURPOSE
DROW BLINDED BY ROGUE
DROW BLINDED BY THE MINION
TRAP DISARMED
TRAVELLED TO UNDERWORLD
SAVED GAME DATA
RETURNED TO LEVEL 6
SAVED GAME DATA
BEGINNING SEARCH, PLEASE STAY STILL...
SEARCH COMPLETE
3 DISCOVERIES
TRAP DISARMED
TRAP DISARMED
SECRET REVEALED
BEGINNING SEARCH, PLEASE STAY STILL...
SEARCH COMPLETE
FOUND NOTHING
DESCENDED TO LEVEL 7
SAVED GAME DATA
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY ROGUE
THE MINION IS HEALED BY THIS SACRIFICE
CACTUAR PLANTED BY ROGUE
ROGUE TORE OUT A CACTUAR HEART
ORC BEAT BY ROGUE
THE MINION IS HEALED BY THIS SACRIFICE
PICKED UP RUNE OF UNDEAD
PICKED UP RUNE OF LIGHT
PICKED UP + FIRE FLIES
STUN TRAP TRIGGERED
STUN DART HITS ROGUE
TRAP DISARMED
BEGINNING SEARCH, PLEASE STAY STILL...
SEARCH COMPLETE
12 DISCOVERIES
PICKED UP + GAUNTLET
GNOLL DECAPITATED BY THE MINION
TRAP DISARMED
DROW BLINDED BY THE MINION
TRAP DISARMED
TRAP DISARMED
TRAP DISARMED
CACTUAR PLANTED BY ROGUE
THE MINION IS HEALED BY THIS SACRIFICE
ROGUE TORE OUT A CACTUAR HEART
TROLL GUTTED BY THE MINION
THE MINION IS HEALED BY THIS SACRIFICE
PICKED UP KNIFE
TRAP DISARMED
BEGINNING SEARCH, PLEASE STAY STILL...
SEARCH COMPLETE
FOUND NOTHING
DROW DECAPITATED BY ROGUE
CACTUAR PLANTED BY ROGUE
DROW BLINDED BY THE MINION
CACTUAR PLANTED BY ROGUE
THE MINION IS HEALED BY THIS SACRIFICE
ROGUE TORE OUT A CACTUAR HEART
DROW BLINDED BY ROGUE
THE MINION IS HEALED BY THIS SACRIFICE
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY ROGUE
ROGUE TORE OUT A KOBOLD HEART
PICKED UP RUNE OF ?
PICKED UP RUNE OF UNDEAD
CACTUAR PLANTED BY ROGUE
DROW BLINDED BY THE MINION
GNOLL ROBBED BY ROGUE
THE MINION IS HEALED BY THIS SACRIFICE
THE MINION IS HEALED BY THIS SACRIFICE
W: + MACE ENCHANTED WITH RUNE OF UNDEAD
W: + MACE ENCHANTED WITH RUNE OF UNDEAD
CACTUAR PLANTED BY THE MINION
PICKED UP KNIFE
PICKED UP + FLIES
TRAPS DISARMED
TRAP DISARMED
GNOLL ROBBED BY THE MINION
CACTUAR PLANTED BY ROGUE
THE MINION IS HEALED BY THIS SACRIFICE
GOBLIN STOPPED BY ROGUE
TRAP DISARMED
TRAP DISARMED
TRAP DISARMED
DROW BLINDED BY ROGUE
CACTUAR PLANTED BY ROGUE
GNOLL ROBBED BY ROGUE
ROGUE TORE OUT A GNOLL HEART
TRAP DISARMED
STUN TRAP TRIGGERED
STUN DART HITS ROGUE
TRAP DISARMED
WELCOME TO LEVEL 8 ROGUE
BEGINNING SEARCH, PLEASE STAY STILL...
SEARCH COMPLETE
1 DISCOVERY
SECRET REVEALED
DESCENDED TO LEVEL 8
SAVED GAME DATA
CACTUAR PLANTED BY THE MINION
TROLL GUTTED BY THE MINION
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY THE MINION
PICKED UP RUNE OF UNDEAD
PICKED UP RUNE OF ?
GNOLL ROBBED BY ROGUE
THE MINION IS HEALED BY THIS SACRIFICE
STUN TRAP TRIGGERED
STUN DART HITS ROGUE
NYMPH SPANKED BY THE MINION
PIT TRAP TRIGGERED
TROLL GUTTED BY THE MINION
STUN TRAP TRIGGERED
STUN DART HITS THE MINION
PICKED UP + HALO
TRAP DISARMED
TELEPORT TRAP TRIGGERED
TRAP DISARMED
TRAP DISARMED
STUN TRAP TRIGGERED
STUN DART HITS ROGUE
TRAP DISARMED
BEGINNING SEARCH, PLEASE STAY STILL...
SEARCH COMPLETE
9 DISCOVERIES
TRAPS DISARMED
TRAP DISARMED
PICKED UP RUNE OF UNDEAD
PICKED UP RUNE OF ?
TRAP DISARMED
TRAP DISARMED
TRAP DISARMED
TRAP DISARMED
DROW BLINDED BY ROGUE
DROW BLINDED BY ROGUE
NYMPH SPANKED BY ROGUE
PIT TRAP TRIGGERED
TRAP DISARMED
GOBLIN STOPPED BY ROGUE
ROGUE TORE OUT A GOBLIN HEART
BEGINNING SEARCH, PLEASE STAY STILL...
SEARCH COMPLETE
2 DISCOVERIES
GNOLL ROBBED BY ROGUE
TRAP DISARMED
SECRET REVEALED
NYMPH SPANKED BY THE MINION
DROW BLINDED BY ROGUE
THE MINION IS HEALED BY THIS SACRIFICE
PICKED UP GAUNTLET
PICKED UP SHORT BOW
EQUIPMENT IS NOW IN ORDER OF PURPOSE
GNOLL ROBBED BY ROGUE
DROW DECAPITATED BY ROGUE
THE MINION IS HEALED BY THIS SACRIFICE
KOBOLD PUNISHED BY ROGUE
THE MINION IS HEALED BY THIS SACRIFICE
ORC BEAT BY THE MINION
THE MINION IS HEALED BY THIS SACRIFICE
PICKED UP + SHORT BOW
EQUIPMENT IS NOW IN ORDER OF PURPOSE
GNOLL ROBBED BY ROGUE
NYMPH SPANKED BY ROGUE
THE MINION IS HEALED BY THIS SACRIFICE
GNOLL ROBBED BY ROGUE
TROLL GUTTED BY THE MINION
PICKED UP KNIFE
ROGUE FINISHED BY GNOLL

[st33d]

Small Update 319

Added name of level and percentage cleared to Lore > Map.

Added a level cleared console message when all traps, secrets, quests and monsters have been cleared from a level.

I figure that it doesn't hurt to know that you've overturned every single stone in the dungeon and there's nothing left to find.

[st33d]

Small Update 320

Minion missile traffic wasn't on - fixed, added brain state copying for commuting monsters (monsters assign their allies in the way with the same task as them), added move out of tile when no clipping a chase target, fixed setStats equip bug, changed level clear msg to level based in main dungeon.

That should be AI all up to date for now.

The fear spell I've figured out: It will create a new creature called a shade that is an evil ghost version of the victim. Shades can pass through all characters and when in contact with their target they will drain health until the target is dead. When the fear spell runs out, the shade evaporates.

Why come up with some complicated AI to control player to run away from enemies when I can scare the shit out of them instead?

[st33d]

I'm thinking that revealed traps (maybe the reveal marker appears only after you search) should auto-disarm when you walk over them. It's only really teleport traps that could be of any use.

Should I implement this and get rid of the Disarm Trap option altogether?

[baconman]

No, because, foolhardy as it is to admit; there's "revealed" traps that I've accidentally stumbled into, and some "found" ones behind chaos walls that - watching my path instead of my map - I foolishly waltzed right into.

Sometimes pit traps are helpful for escaping hordes, too; or at least rallying them all on one side of you if you're surrounded. ...sometimes.

Gotta let "human error" run it's course. I'd hotkey disarms (if they aren't already), though.

[JobLeonard]

The whole point of traps is to punish those who don't pay attention... So what baconman said.

[Nate_G]

Completely agree with JobLeonard and baconman

[st33d]

what if I give you the ability to trigger a revealed trap instead of disarming it if you're holding down?

[mokesmoe]

It's really easy to reveal all the traps by searching though.

[mokesmoe]

I was messing around with the test room and the AI, and I found some cool things.

First: the AI can navigate this really well:

Code:

##########

(# = ladders)

And this as well:

Code:

## ### ##
 # # # #
 ### ###

But the coolest thing is if you  make this:

Code:

###########
# # # # # #
# # # # # #
# # # # # #
# # # # # #
# # # # # #

Generate the AI mesh, then take away the connecting bits like this:

Code:

# # # # # #
# # # # # #
# # # # # #
# # # # # #
# # # # # #
# # # # # #

But don't re-generate the path so it still goes along the top, the AI will jump from ladder to ladder like a boss.


It would be awesome is there was a special case where is there were to tall enough ladders with an one space gap between them it would generate a path across the top. I understand if you can't though.

[st33d]

Depends if it was consistent between all character speeds.

There's still issues will flee-ing logic I'm working on and I've remembered that I wanted to solve throwing weapons and bravery as well.

[mokesmoe]

The height needed to jump ladders isn't consistent, and golems and trolls can't do it. (or need a really high ladder)

However, I noticed no bad side affects of making AI nodes off the side of the top of a ladder. In fact, I went into a dungeon and made some fake AI nodes off the edge of every ledge in a room. The AI's patrol route avoided the fake node automatically, so the enemies didn't walk off the edge by accident. Also, the AI got better at chasing me as it ran off the edge at me, also give it a better chance to stun me too.

So maybe not the ladder thing, but I would advise putting a one-way node path horizontally off of ledges into the air, and then a downwards path from there.

And if the AI tries to "jump" somewhere is can't, it automatically finds a new route when it falls.

[st33d]

I've put your ninja-nodes idea on my todo list, but my main concern is if it's possible to game the AI of slower monsters. Leaping on to an adjacent ladder is no use if you end up below the enemy.

Enemies are programmed to run away if their target is directly above them (unlike the minion). So them doing ninja stunts is no good if it just tricks them into suicide. AI exploits that aren't difficult to pull off are unacceptable.

I'll need to brute force check this stuff for logic flaws before okaying it.

I'm currently testing out new flee logic and throwing weapon logic.

[mokesmoe]

Is it wrong that I do almost all my enemy testing by spawning clones of myself? (I use other races sometimes for their speeds.)

Slower monsters will be far enough down the ladder that it wouldn't be any easier than when they try to climb a ladder and change their minds once you are over it. You should also let the AI drop off of a ladder if you are directly above them, because you can use that to game the AI of slower monsters as it is. Just stand next to the top of a ladder, wait for the slow monster to be almost at the top, then move over and drop on him. The ninja trick would just cause this same scenario, but with the monster lower and therefore safer.

And no matter how hard I try, I can't get a goblin to jump into my feet either.
I just did it by jumping off the ladder with careful timing while starting right above where the goblin starts to meet the ladder. (Just moving down didn't work.) When I tried it a second time I was slightly too early and he stunned me instead. Sounds difficult enough to me. (And fun! It's like a duel.)