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[GalaethGames]

I love the menu, beautiful. can't wait for this to be finished!

[Ninja Dodo]

Some new sprites:

[Ninja Dodo]

Working on some templates for more vases:



Based on diagram of different types, with layers arranged in such a way that I can easily create new ones.

[Ninja Dodo]

New video:





There's a new demo build as well, though this more of an incremental update as the demo does not include some of the WIP features shown in this and previous videos (eg the lion). Does have the heavy lifting though.

Download: http://www.ninjadodo.net/temp/hellas/hellas_v23_1_win_demo.zip

[GalaethGames]

it's looking good!  This looks like it will be really fun to play, can't wait!

I like the idea of collecting the helmets!

[Mongolianmisfit]

I've been tracking this game since it first popped up on indiedb.com. I still excited for its release and I'm loving the new demo build. In fact, I made a TIG account just so I could post on this thread. I really hope this game isn't abandoned, as even in the wake of Apotheon, Hellas still feels unique enough to have its own audience. I eagerly await more updates on development. Good luck!

[Ninja Dodo]

@sionco: Thanks ^^

@Mongolianmisfit: Thank you. It's going slowly but it's definitely still going.

[KRSplat]

Cool prototype! It feels like a fun game 

[Franklin's Ghost]

Nice to see you're still working on this

Liking the new gameplay video, the new additions seem to work really well.

[Ninja Dodo]

@KRSplat & Franklins: Thanks.


So as I'm continuing this devlog, I may as well elaborate on some recent design decisions...

When I finished the prototype I thought I'd covered most of the key gameplay elements and the rest of the game would mostly be level and enemy design, even though I knew in the back of my mind certain elements of the stories I wanted to cover would require new mechanics if I was going to stay more or less true to the source material. It turns out that some of these new elements are trickier to design and implement than I thought (welcome to game development ). Case in point: moving platforms.

Another such problem was the carrying of objects.



The hero, Herakles, does quite a lot of lifting things and it's also somewhat of a recurring visual theme in Greek art. Being able to lift and throw objects was always going to be something the game would need.

Question was, how to add this in a way that fit elegantly with existing controls?

The game is most fun when the player is moving around so it was important to avoid limiting mobility too much, but also to keep the system similar to spears so as not to be confusing.

Contstraints:
- don't pick up objects when intending sword attack
- want to be able to pick up things quickly and easily without having to stop
- avoid adding new buttons if possible (needs to work on gamepad + less confusing)
- should be intuitive/consistent

Option one: Make them exactly like spears where pressing ATTACK near any heavy object will lift it, but this would mean accidentally picking up nearby stones when you want to attack...

Option two: DOWN + ATTACK, like Spelunky, but since duck/block brings everything to a halt this conflicts with the aim of keeping the player mobile. Also prevents sword attack from blocking near liftable objects.

Option three: I considered HELD ATTACK to lift but such a delay would also effectively mean stopping the player, preventing mobility.

Another question: should I even allow picking up objects while you are standing on them, Super Mario Bros 2 style? My initial thought was no and while this made logical sense, it felt unintuitive having to first step down to grab an object and broke the flow of movement.

Option four: A separate button for grabbing objects, but I didn't want to do that since it would be confusing when you grab spears with ATTACK, plus the game is already bordering on too many buttons.

My solution (as seen in v23) was to create separate armed and unarmed states which the player could switch between with DROP/CANCEL so that they can put away their sword and then simply press ATTACK, same as spears, to pick up any heavy object. Also allows for the possibility of using ATTACK as a contextual action or talk button when unarmed, which may be useful later.

Fairly happy with how it's working now.

[Ninja Dodo]

If you follow my other project, Guppy, you might already be aware that I'm looking into supporting Mac going forward. I've been tinkering with it for a bit and it seems to be working now. I've uploaded a build here if anyone wants to try it out:

http://www.ninjadodo.net/temp/mactest/Hellas.app.zip

I was going to do Linux for v23 as well, but I somehow managed to break my virtual Ubuntu and am having trouble getting it working again so, uh, that will be later.

[Ninja Dodo]

So a couple weeks ago was PROCJAM, and for the occasion I decided to do some work on semi-procedural rock formations for Hellas. I'd been thinking about how to handle natural environments in this game for a while and this seemed like a good time to make some progress on that.




On Procedural Elements

Now, I've always wanted to have *some* procedural bits in the game, but hadn't really landed on exactly how and where. Working on Guppy taught me that sooner or later you get really really bored of testing the same level over and over and having some randomized elements helps break up the repetition, increasing replayability, and making development a lot more enjoyable.

My initial thought was to do something akin to Left 4 Dead's AI Director where the level design is static but encounters are dynamically varied based on how the player is doing. So one time an enemy might come from one direction and the next time he might appear sooner (or later) and from the other side, with different emergent elements affecting the outcome.

Randomizing level layouts seemed interesting as well but outside of maybe Daedalus' labyrinth I couldn't think of a good in-fiction justification for randomly changing environments (and I do like to have one where possible).

Then I thought: hang on a minute... Oral tradition!

One of the key features of Greek myth is that it's slightly different every time! There is no single correct version. While the broad strokes and themes tend to stay the same, details change with each telling. Why not environments? It's perfect!

So in keeping with this tradition, each playthrough will be a slightly different version: with directed but variable levels (to varying degrees), procedural generation somewhere between Left 4 Dead, Spelunky and Diablo, and player choices that map to different known versions of the stories... more replayable, more fun to develop and more in keeping with the source material!

An early test version (with placeholder sketch art) is up on itchio: http://ninjadodo.itch.io/hellasrocktest

... or here: http://ninjadodo.net/temp/hellas/hellas_procjam_rocktest_v3.zip

In other news, I finally went on a research trip to Athens, Delphi, Epidaurus, Mycenae and Nemea. Here are some photos.

[de11ed]

YAY! So glad your still working on this game, I just love the idea and the art of the game is just so damn neat. Keep it up man

[oahda]

Oooh, that's a great idea.

[r0ber7]

Hey, awesome, still going I see!

I just picked up my own long term project as well, and remembered this forum. Then I remembered this game.

Good luck to you and your efforts. May we both finish our games. 

[Ninja Dodo]

Yup, dogged persistence is a useful thing sometimes. Good luck to you too!

And belated thanks @de11ed and Prinsessa! 

[sakrirafael]

Your style is very unique. Sketching on real paper definitely takes the look of the game to another level.

[Ninja Dodo]

Thanks. Personally I find I draw better on paper than I do on the computer, so it definitely helps the style, BUT I should note that all sketch art is placeholder. The final look will be more like other screenshots in this devlog: black on orange/red background with ceramic texture.

I use these sketches to quickly test a first pass on the art, so I can implement stuff without having to wait for final art AND get a sense of how well the art is working so far, if I need to make any adjustments, etc. Saves time.

[Ninja Dodo]

So it's been a while (2016) since I last updated this devlog. Figured I should remedy that.

I am still slowly but surely chipping away at the game, on and off. I haven't had as much time to work on it as I would like and it has often been on hold entirely for months as work and other things have gotten in the way.

While I haven't kept up with the devlog, I have been making *some* progress in the past few years. So to start I'll be posting a recap of some of the stuff I've been up to...

I stopped sharing complete builds of the game around version 20 and the last demo was for v23. I was thinking of doing some closed testing at the time, but in the interest of showing tangible progress I'm going to just release a few of those WIP versions now:

hellas_v24_win.zip - from 20-01-16 (includes boar & lion test levels)


v24 - changelist

- procedural lvls 1st pass (layout, items, temp art)

- reworking slope collision [WIP]

- DOWN + JUMP to drop from pass platforms

- jump only once when JUMP held down

- player no longer does falling dmg [too confusing]

- start without shield, pick up in lion cave (or later)

- lion invulnerable to piercing weapons

- lion improved jumping over gaps while chasing

- lion jumps or drops down from tiny platforms

- fixed: lion never jumping up (only down) on patrol

- increased heavy walk speed

- tweaks to heavy throw speeds in air and moving

- skeletons (visibly) anticipate jump from stand

- skeletons take friendly fire from spears

- players + skeletons drop spear when bashed without block

- skeleton alerted by nearby attacks

- fixed: skeleton skipping reaction time if player lands right in front

- stone blocks have hitpoints, break on 3x hard impact

- decreased height needed to break fragile rocks

- screen shake for stone breaking on heavy enemy

- improved stone break particle fx

- GRAB-power divine hand grabs empty air when no target under cursor

- if BLOCK held during climb, hero goes back to block after climb

- gamepad: L1/R1 no longer used [feels better with block & power on Triggers only]

- VS: re-arranged HUD, sacrifices top right, score top center

- revised dmg source detection, fixed sheep not always detecting correctly

- fixed: broken player transition on throw before landing

- fixed: wine sacrifices not respawning in VS

- ported legacy audio code to GM Studio system

- misc tweaks


That build was from January so this was mostly stuff I worked on the previous year (2015).

[Ninja Dodo]

Recap continued : 2016-2017

According to my notes, the things I worked on in 2016 and early 2017 were, among other things:

- Added boar AI fleeing behaviour (if threatened by lion or other danger)

- Added a stunned AI state for lion, having it to crash to the ground if stunned in mid-air.




- I did a 1st pass on a Hydra prototype, figuring out head and body positioning.




- I created a dialogue system with multiple options and the ability to walk away and return.




- I made the main menu modular so I can easily re-arrange and swap out different options.



- And I adapted the game from 4:3 to 16:9 widescreen.


hellas_v25_win.zip - from 04-07-17 (includes palace test level with WIP dialogue system)


v25 - changelist

- added dialogue system 1st pass

- modular menus, built from any arrangement of options

- added more test lvls to menu

- procgen: allow random start position

- lion: spiral over head when stunned

- lion: crashes into ground if stunned in air, hurt on land

- boar: separate idle and alert stand sprites

- AI fleeing behaviour: boar flees from lion

- skel: no longer blocks sword attacks

- object throw distance tuning (spears, stones & vases)

- increased min jump height if button let go early

- added 16:9 support, auto aspect ratio

- revised player collision

- reorganized sprite depth into layers

- climb on pass platforms [WIP]

- fixed: enemies not walking on moving platforms

- fixed: enemies getting stuck at lvl edge

- fixed: climb walk from pass platform not showing climb sprite

- fixed: spears colliding before wall, instead of at wall

- fixed: incorrect impact v on death for plyr & npcs

- fixed: sheep having too much air resistance

- various clean up


Towards the end of the year I began porting everything to Game Maker Studio 2, which had just launched.