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[ChevyRay]

I've considered trying game maker again, but it's not cross-platform. I'm looking forward to seeing where this goes.

That's my biggest issue with using it so many compatibility issues (Apple computers, NVidia cards, etc.)

[TeeGee]

Here is my 2 cents: you are using only open-source APIs that are cross-platform. If you could release simultaneously on Mac, Linux and PC, you would instantly have a massive fanbase of people defecting from GameMaker, who are really dragging their feet on the mac port. In fact, I won't be surprised if they don't release their mac port for another six months or a year. People desperately want to release indie games for all three platforms.

I wanted to post exactly the same thing. If it would be PC-only, I probably wouldn't want to spend time on learning another language.

[rogerlevy]

Here is my 2 cents: you are using only open-source APIs that are cross-platform. If you could release simultaneously on Mac, Linux and PC, you would instantly have a massive fanbase of people defecting from GameMaker, who are really dragging their feet on the mac port. In fact, I won't be surprised if they don't release their mac port for another six months or a year. People desperately want to release indie games for all three platforms.

I wanted to post exactly the same thing. If it would be PC-only, I probably wouldn't want to spend time on learning another language.

Yeah, I chose to only use these libraries because I wanted it to be cross-platform.  Definitely Linux and Mac are targets.  @Bennett, a simultaneous tri-platform release would be a tall order, wouldn't it!  I believe it should be very possible for it to be ported to Linux quickly because SwiftForth already has a Linux version in beta that seems to be coming along nicely.  There is also a Mac port being done by an unaffiliated third party, though I don't know how well that is going.  At the worst, it would have to be ported to the popular Mac Forth PowerMops.  I could definitely see at least a simultaneous PC+Linux release.  All I know is I cannot do porting by myself because I don't use the other OS's.

Also @Bennett, I really like that idea about the in-program download service.  I don't know if it would be worth it as the Web seems to be a better platform but if I come upon an easy way to make secure http requests etc in Forth then I may go down that path...

I have another important question for the forum ... this program runs as a game, that is, it continually updates the screen, like a game, thus supporting lots of animated effects, but this means it is a CPU hogger.  I may try to add a smart CPU-saving feature, i.e. based on how little time a frame takes to generate, pad the rest of it with a call to Sleep, but I don't know if it will work.  But I mean would anyone feel concerned about this?

[Problem Machine]

Why not add hotkeys to turn off certain expensive effects, like how one can rapidly switch between different lighting styles in 3d modeling programs?

[rogerlevy]

Well, here's the thing, usually the screen is not really even moving yet 100% CPU *was* being used due how the graphics driver has been programmed, so a hotkey would not do much to help.  I've already tried my idea for a slight delay and the CPU usage *low* is now 40% which is not bad.  WHat's weird is I never even thought of fixing this until I posted on this forum, which got me thinking about how wasteful it could be.  After the research I did yesterday I think I might be able to control it pretty well so this is no longer a real issue.

[rogerlevy]

Hmmm though now that I think of it, a "wireframe mode", say for laptop users who can't stay away from their work on the train or what have you, would be pretty cool wouldn't it ... 

[rogerlevy]

Sorry for all the addendum-posting!  I said "wireframe" but this would only be useful in 3D games with lots of drawing - so to save people guessing I'll just point out that this system fully supports reasonably-fast 3D ... it won't hold a candle to plain C++ but it will be a large improvement over GM, at least in terms of the possibilities beyond the initial release.

[rogerlevy]

[I removed what was in this post.]

[Hajo]

I have another important question for the forum ... this program runs as a game, that is, it continually updates the screen, like a game, thus supporting lots of animated effects, but this means it is a CPU hogger.  I may try to add a smart CPU-saving feature, i.e. based on how little time a frame takes to generate, pad the rest of it with a call to Sleep, but I don't know if it will work.  But I mean would anyone feel concerned about this?

Yes. Event driven screen updates are not rocket science anymore. Only update the screen if really needed, and only update the parts that really need an update.

Sleep will help other programs, but take away CPU time for the games logic also ... better be clever on screen updates, allow the game logic to use the CPU time that is there, and otherwise hand free CPU cycles to other software.

[nihilocrat]

Check out Lua for use as the game's scripting language. It's fast, portable, etc. etc., most importantly it is a) really easy to learn due to its minimalism and b) has tables. Higher-order data structures are something I think are essential to a scripting language. It's technically not OO, but it provides some syntatic sugar which makes it good enough for OO programming.

[rogerlevy]

@Hajo: Certainly. Well at the least it will know when the screen is "not moving" and release the CPU until an event occurs.  At present it simply yields the CPU for some time based on how long it took to generate the last frame.  So no CPU is thrown away. 

@nihilocat: Hmm, maybe I'll take a look at it - I can't change to another scripting language, but maybe it will give me some ideas.

[Hajo]

@Hajo: Certainly. Well at the least it will know when the screen is "not moving" and release the CPU until an event occurs.  At present it simply yields the CPU for some time based on how long it took to generate the last frame.  So no CPU is thrown away. 

Good I must admit, a real and fully event driven screen update mechanism can be inefficient too. Some middle ground will be best, and you seem to strive for that, which should be fine.

[rogerlevy]

Ok, so, if anyone's still interested, I've started a blog.  http://rogerlevy.net/eminence/blog.   Nothing earth-smashing right now.  Just a sort of stub/intro post, and some of it is more or less what I already wrote here but there is a little more new info.  Gotta start somewhere.  Also there are some of the characters I've been designing for my own games hanging around the title. 

There'll be more to come. 

[Xion]

I just want to say that this sounds awesome.

*encourage encourage encourage*

[AshleysBrain]

Have you heard of my project, Construct?  I thought we were the "other" game maker, but maybe we'll have some competition soon

[rogerlevy]

@AshleysBrain - Hey.  Yeah, we're both making "Other Game Maker"'s, yes.  I venture to highlight that mine is going to be verrry different from yours, so, at least both have a reason for existing.  I am only concentrating on doing this for my personal enjoyment at the moment.  Though I take your noticing it as a sign of encouragement.

Your prog looks pretty sweet btw.  Was it a lot of work?  It's a little Visual Studio-ey for me, (that program and I have drunk sex), but we'll see, who knows, maybe we could end up inspiring the other... (I don't mean copying each other, just, you know, "get ideas")  Anyway thanks for the post!



@Xion - Glad you think so, and thanks..

[Krux]

A new tool? Of course, as long as the tool is useful people will use it. If your project makes game development groundbreaking easyly, then you can make much money.

[Damian]

I think if this has all the features you describes, I will def be encouraged to learn the language.

I'll check out the blog then 

[rogerlevy]

I think if this has all the features you describes, I will def be encouraged to learn the language.

I'll check out the blog then 

Hey. My website was suspended for a couple days b/c I needed to update my credit card, so,  you might have gotten a broken link when you tried to check it out.  Anyway it's back up now!

I have a question for everyone.

What would people rather have between these: More out-of-the-box "generic" tools, or more room for building your own? 

The reason I'm asking this is- I'm thinking about my own game, and I'm thinking it would be nice to  not have to worry about tools that would be "universal" and just concentrate and doing what I want/need for THIS game.  So it would actually be easier for me to provide the latter choice from above and release something sooner.  But then, it would probably be only a language at that point and less of a full-fledged environment like GM.  What do others think???

[Damian]

That sounds like an idea. It would serve well if you did that first and then later engage people with a full fledge enviroment. It would give others to have the opertunity to get the know how the language. Not to mention, people would start recognising your work more.

I'd actually like to see a game as a result of you or someone using it. I'd like to see people push the boundries to see whats possible at this moment in time.

Well thats might just be me though.