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[phubans]

So summer is here and I'm on a 3 week break from school. For the past few months, I've been scouring craigslist, trying to pick up gigs as a graphic designer, game tester, and even a restaurant server (those are all areas I have previous work experience in)... Well, no matter how professionally I present myself or hard I try, I simply cannot seem to find any work right now. I've had to ask my parents more than once to help me, and they aren't really in the financial position to be doing it. Being that I live in San Francisco (the second most expensive city in the US) doesn't really help, either.

I don't have a job, and my primary source of income is via student loan refund checks that are putting me into massive debt... and they're barely enough to get me through each quarter. In fact, my refund checks cover rent & bills, leaving me with about $200 a month to spend on food, which isn't quite enough. I consider myself somewhat talented, quite professional, and very hard-working, yet for the life of me I simply cannot find work. And while designing indie games is what I love, there is absolutely no money to be made in it for me.

So I'm just wondering how many other people are in the same boat and how they survive. I need tips on what I can do to make ends meet while I finish school and find time to spend on what I really love, which is game making. I need to know websites where I can apply for gigs in my field of experience, or tips on how to turn my passion for indie game design into real revenue. Any help on the matter would be immensely appreciated. I don't know how much longer I can do this...

[Farbs]

People occasionally arrange contract gamedev work on the indiegamer forums. Have you tried there?

[ஒழுக்கின்மை (Paul Eres)]

you can also try this:

http://www.elance.com/

but if you're asking how indies survive, most don't. the few that do have been in the business for many years and are very business-oriented, spending as much time marketing as making games

[Super Joe]

gaming casinos free of state regulation; some of them have their own mickey mouse athletic commissions and whatever but really its all about a new market (an illicit one) rather than diverting from others

[phubans]

Thanks for the feedback guys, I haven't tried those forums but I will definitely check them out!

Paul, that's really unfortunate because I think a lot of artists and designers don't really know much about business or marketing. As for me, I don't know anything about it. Can the fundamentals be self-taught or does it require a degree?

[yesfish]

Craigslist and other websites are useless for getting jobs. No exceptions.

You have to go into shops, ask at the counter if they've got positions, track down businesses in the area, hand CVs in, phone them up and act like you really really want a job. Even if they have no positions going, you apply anyway incase one appears and they remember your enthusiasm.

I spent over a year trying to find work. I ended up in a shit fulltime job for several months with no time for anything else, but I saved up a lot of money. Then the recession came and a much less painful part-time position at a supermarket practically leapt at me whilst everyone else was losing their job. Oh irony.

So I now work average 4 hours a day then come home and develop my game. If I can deliver and make money, I'll start another one and try to improve on what I'm learning this time, making a name for myself. If I don't make any money by game 3 then I should probably start looking for another field of work, lol.


You're going to have to do a shit job that you hate for a while. This is very likely. If you want to try and develop and publish a game yourself you have to be confident that you can do it within a time limit and that you can...well, do it. If you want to join the games industry (indie or otherwise) then it's best to take a course in your favourite part of game development (programming, art, etc.), build a portfolio in your spare time and then track down game dev businesses in the area or further if you're prepared to move (but you can look in the internet for game dev businesses. As long as you go to their official websites and contact them directly, NOT craigslist), hand CVs in, phone them up and act like you really really want a job.

So same as before, only second time round it'll be for something you actually do want.

[ஒழுக்கின்மை (Paul Eres)]

Thanks for the feedback guys, I haven't tried those forums but I will definitely check them out!

Paul, that's really unfortunate because I think a lot of artists and designers don't really know much about business or marketing. As for me, I don't know anything about it. Can the fundamentals be self-taught or does it require a degree?

it's usually self-taught, as far as i know. it's not difficult, just time-consuming. if you don't particularly like it you could always join up with an someone else who doesn't mind it, or you could try creating games for the consoles or iphone or Flash, they operate under different business models and aren't as reliant on the developer marketing their own games as PC shareware is

[phubans]

yesfish, that's very sound advice... As much as I don't want to have to suck it up and apply for "ordinary" jobs, it might be what I have to do. I just figured that by this point with being credited for QA in a few games as well as having a somewhat decent portfolio I could do a little better than cashier at Walgreens

Paul, I'd love to develop for iPhone or XBox, but at the same time I'm not too sure if I could find the time or energy to learn XNA scripting, so finding a partner would be very ideal for me. Problem is, I'm just not sure where to find someone like that. I know there's a team request thread somewhere on here, but it seems like it would be more beneficial to have an actual team request board.

[aeiowu]

Craigslist and other websites are useless for getting jobs. No exceptions.

You have to go into shops, ask at the counter if they've got positions, track down businesses in the area, hand CVs in, phone them up and act like you really really want a job. Even if they have no positions going, you apply anyway incase one appears and they remember your enthusiasm.

I spent over a year trying to find work. I ended up in a shit fulltime job for several months with no time for anything else, but I saved up a lot of money. Then the recession came and a much less painful part-time position at a supermarket practically leapt at me whilst everyone else was losing their job. Oh irony.

So I now work average 4 hours a day then come home and develop my game. If I can deliver and make money, I'll start another one and try to improve on what I'm learning this time, making a name for myself. If I don't make any money by game 3 then I should probably start looking for another field of work, lol.


You're going to have to do a shit job that you hate for a while. This is very likely. If you want to try and develop and publish a game yourself you have to be confident that you can do it within a time limit and that you can...well, do it. If you want to join the games industry (indie or otherwise) then it's best to take a course in your favourite part of game development (programming, art, etc.), build a portfolio in your spare time and then track down game dev businesses in the area or further if you're prepared to move (but you can look in the internet for game dev businesses. As long as you go to their official websites and contact them directly, NOT craigslist), hand CVs in, phone them up and act like you really really want a job.

So same as before, only second time round it'll be for something you actually do want.

I courteously disagree with all of this advice.

Paul, you have a three week break between school, I'm not sure you'll be able to even find something in that three weeks. Are you looking for side work while you're in school as well?

[Chris Z]

Get a day job.

[Mipe]

Just get outside and ask around. Trim gardens, babysit, chop firewood for the money. Ask your friends, colleagues etc. - especially those that work part time - how can they get some work to do and get paid.

[Radix]

Sell all your shit and move to China.

[___]

I am funding Snapshot development via part time job. :I

[LazyWaffle]

Sell your body to prostitution.

Or work at McDonalds until you can find a good job. A crappy job is better than no job.

[godsavant]

Get a day job.

This.

I'm planning to go to law school and make indie games on the five days out of the week  I don't have to go to work.

[nihilocrat]

Craigslist and other websites are useless for getting jobs. No exceptions.

Exception 1: I found the game industry job I have right now from a craigslist ad. It is not a very sexy job (backend tools programming) but it's a job, pays the going rate, and is in the industry.

Exception 2: I scored several interviews after submitting CVs on careerbuilder.com and several other sites. One of them was a game company.

Maybe I'm an exception because I have marketable job skills, and you can't really walk up and submit your CV in person when you a) don't know the company exists, or b) they are hidden somewhere in an office park, behind locked doors, and don't post their address because they don't want random people visiting.


To the OP: Yeah, get a day job. Eventually you might be able to sell a game that would let you take the first step, but as said before, full-time indies tend to be people who have been around awhile and really know the business side. You've got to follow up a success with more successes.

[Havok]

Okay I totally understand where you are right now. I am also a student at a college near Los Angeles working on my degree in music theory & composition. I also live on student loans and am fortunate enough to have a wife and two kids. Needless to say it becomes quite a strain to keep expenses at an absolute minimum and even at that know you are digging a hole of debt. I spent two years working a job full-time, attending college full-time, and trying to get it some extra composing time before it worked out that I could live off loans and try to make a career in video game audio.

I know that there are differences between developing games and writing music but we are both interested in making it in the game industry. I've found that the biggest thing you can do is buckle down and do the work and do a lot of it and do it well. Stretch some boundaries and make people take notice of you. Granted I've just begun that but it is beginning to pay off. You seem to have a great portfolio going for you and I would think you have a great start to an indie career.

Marketing IS the big part. On my end I might receive one small job for 15-20 rejections. That's just the way it is. For a developer a website, posting on many different forums, entering competitions, GDC, and plenty of other things would need to be pursued regularly. Having a killer game to go along with these things will make it pay off for you. All this is assuming you are interested in the indie track.

I also made the decision between debt and a job. I decided that this is the time for me to work on establishing a career I would love so I'm taking the plunge. The hope is that I'll be able to make it when my college career finally comes to an end and I reenter the real world. It may be different for you but for me this will make everything else worthwhile.

Hope that maybe this helps. If you want to ask any specific questions pm me.

And another link: Gamedev.net Check out their help wanted forum for possible jobs. They are posted pretty regularly.

[bateleur]

trying to pick up gigs as a graphic designer, game tester

The difficulty with these skills is that they're not sufficiently scarce. Even if you're slightly better at stuff than the competition that doesn't help if the vast pool of applicants has already sucked up all the jobs.

Is graphic designer your professional/academic field, or is it a sideline for you? If the former, get used to being poor. (No, that isn't me being nasty, a couple of my friends are designers.)

Thing is, there is another way into indie game development. Get a day job that pays well and live well below your means, then you'll be able to gradually buy back your working life until you can afford to spend time on games exclusively. It's a slow process, of course, but it has the advantage of being fairly reliable. And in the meantime you can still do game stuff across evenings and weekends if you're dedicated enough. You didn't want a life, did you? ;-)

[Aquin]

I survive by working construction and any odd job I can find.

I would *love* to work a computer-related job, but I always get turned down.  Apparently not having experience is anathema to the hiring process.

The sad thing is that I probably do more computer-related work at home than I would ever do in any such job.

[xiotex]

In my view developing indie games is a secondary business on top of my main job which is working for game developers. If I make money out of it then that is a bonus